Need strip canoe design advice

[alteran]

Want help in deciding what tandem strip canoe to build. I've decided to build one this winter just for the fun of building another.
Specs. Tandem day tripper with capacity for weekend gear once in a blue moon. 60 pounds or less would be nice. Will see no whitewater use, mostly class 2 or less rivers and lake use. Prefer only a small rise in bow and stern. 17 feet or a little less. Good tracking and mannerly enough for beginning paddlers.
Will probably be virola wood with walnut and or aspen accents. Ash rails, seat frames and thwarts.

Have any suggestions?
Thanks, Al.

[captain's gig]

just to get the canoe rolling, bob's special has a low bow, but is only 15'. Can it be stretched?

http://www.michneboat.com/images/MVC-803S.jpg

[alteran]

That is the type of design that is pleasing to my eye. Stretching it should not be a problem.
Do you have a feel for how it paddles, turns, tracks, initial stability, final stability?

[essaunders]

I had looked at a Bob's special up at Newfound Woodwork's Rendezvous. I believe I even paddled it. However, I don't remember anything about it's behavior. Newfound's page Here (http://www.newfound.com/bobsspecial.htm) gives some information.

As I was looking up the previous link I found this:
http://www.newfoundrendezvous.org/Images/Dscf0153.jpg
That's me and my father test sailing our improvised rig in his Aluminum 17' gumman eagle canoe (btw, I really like the way that canoe behaves...Perhaps lines could be patterened after that?)

[captain's gig]

Stability factors from bearmountainboat site:

"The Chestnut 50-lb. Special has been designed to meet a certain demand for an extremely light weight canoe of good carrying capacity and has proved very popular. Owing to its width and flat bottom it is very steady"

Canoe Hull Type Stability
Factor Optimum
Capacity (lbs)
18/6 C1 Marathon (250 lbs) Asym 49 150-250
13/0 Rob Roy (250 lbs) Asym 71 110-250
16/0 Lorna Sym 74 280-390
16/0 Peterborough Canadien Sym 86 280-390
15/0 Hiawatha Sym 88 150-390
17/6 Redbird Sym 92 280-510
15/9 Huron Cruiser Sym 92 280-450
16/0 Champlain Sym 92 280-450
17/0 Solo (250 lbs) Asym 92 150-250
15/6 Cottage Cruiser Sym 97 150-450
17/0 Freedom Asym 98 150-510
15/0 Bob's Special Sym 100 350-540
19/9 Chaa Creek Expedition Asym 102 400-750
17/0 Nomad Sym 102 350-680
16/0 Prospector Sym 103 350-540
15/0 Prospector Ranger Sym 104 150-450
15/0 Freedom Asym 104 150-450
17/9 Freedom Asym 111 400-680

[ 10-22-2004, 08:08 PM: Message edited by: captain's gig ]

[Steve Lansdowne]

The Bob's Special is a very popular design. Check out the builders forum at www.bearmountainboats.com (http://www.bearmountainboats.com) for assistance in building.

[JimConlin]

I stretched my Bob's Special to almost 16' Materials are atlantic WC planking, ash outwales, sitka inwales. Weight is 50#.
I think it meets your needs very well.

[alteran]

How did you stretch it Jim? Just spacing out all the stations or adding more length in the center only? And how do you think it would have worked if you went to 17 feet?

Al.

[JimConlin]

On that design, the stations are evenly spaced. I added the same amount, 1/2" or 3/4" to each interval. Didn't stretch the stem molds. That'd be mouse-milking.

The step-by-step in Canoecraft and the WB pub by Ted Moores on building the design were very helpful. It being my first stripper, i didn't get creative.

[ 10-24-2004, 10:25 AM: Message edited by: JimConlin ]

[FG]

My first thought was bobs special too.

But after more consideration, if you want a more efficient hull, look at the freedom 15 or 17.

Any design you pick can have low ends. That is an easy modification.

[alteran]

The Freedom 17 does sounds nice. That might be it. I have about 1 more month before I start. Any other ideas are welcome.

Has anyone used 3/16th in. strips instead of 1/4"? I've read that they are enough more flexible that it makes the curved areas much easier to strip.

[cs]

Al, I did my MicMac from 5/16" rather than 1/4" or more excatly I used a fat 1/4" strip, and I had no problem makeing any of the bends. That is except the keel strip that I added, but once I tried ash at the keel strip it was no problem. The rest of the strips were Lowe's doug fir.

I don't have much experiance with canoes, but I really like the Micmac from Hazen's "Strippers Guide to Canoe Building"

Chad

[NormMessinger]

Well, if you want my expert advice, yer out of luck. However, Todd probably knows as much about canoes and kayaks as any of us here. He has sung the praises of the 18' Micmac. No more than I know about it, that's what I'd build if I were going to do another.

[Cuyahoga Chuck]

Choice of hull shapes has a lot to do with the ability of the people that are holding the paddles.
If you want better performance arched bottoms are the way to go but expect less stability. If you must have flat bottom stability then expect to paddle harder or accept lower speed.
If the canoe will be used by a single paddler weight may be an issue. No matter how gorgeous the wood if the boat is hard to carry and hard to paddle it will spend a lot of time on dry land.
Charlie

[Paulyboy]

Two questions-what kind of canoe holds a 400 lb man (yes, I weigh 400 lbs but I'm active and a 3rd degree black belt-it"s possible to be fat and active at the same time) and what advantages would the flat bottom have for my size?

[htom]

Flat bottoms have more intitial stability and less ultimate stability, while the rounder bottoms have less initial and more ultimate. Circular bottoms have constant -- and very low! -- stability.

Displacement, for four hundred pounds you're looking for a big canoe, one that's normally a two or three person, and one that's considerably heavier built than normal, because your weight is a point load rather than distributed along the hull. I'd write to Steve Killing at Bear Mountain and ask about how to modify his Freedom 17-9 to use either as a solo or a tandem. http://www.bearmountainboats.com/17-9Freedom.htm