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View Full Version : A Sad Day when Michael Moore makes sense



bobbys
03-20-2011, 06:02 PM
Well Obviously He Didn't Mean If He's the President. Duh. (http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2011/03/18/libya)
"The President does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally
authorize a military attack ..." Barack Obama, December 20, 2007

bobbys
03-20-2011, 06:03 PM
Meet Our New Best Frenemies (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/19/extremists-among-libya-rebels_n_837894.html)
Some of Libyan rebels likely to be Islamist extremists who fought U.S. in Iraq

bobbys
03-20-2011, 06:04 PM
Mere hours after bombing begins, Arab League Secretary General
Amr Moussa issues statement criticizing it

bobbys
03-20-2011, 06:10 PM
"#1. If the Arab League supports this military action, why haven't they sent in their Arab troops and planes in real amounts? Uh-huh"

bobbys
03-20-2011, 06:11 PM
"Who starts a war in Africa then heads off to South America? Is that weird, or is he just loaded with that much cool?"

bobbys
03-20-2011, 06:12 PM
"Coalition-licious! MSNBC reports U.S. carrying out "almost all military operations" http://j.mp/gXOY4I "

bobbys
03-20-2011, 06:14 PM
"OK. Let's hear from the "liberals" who say this is a just war because we're protecting innocent Libyans--like that's what we do!"

ASHDUMP
03-20-2011, 06:17 PM
There is no liberal justification for whats going on in Libya - They're just now finding out that their messiah is just like everyone else....

bobbys
03-20-2011, 06:19 PM
There is no liberal justification for whats going on in Libya - They're just now finding out that their messiah is just like everyone else.....

Is there a Mission statement and a Exit Strategy?

ASHDUMP
03-20-2011, 06:19 PM
Its so funny how ultra liberal papers/websites are reporting this ordeal like real journalists..... almost like they don't have an opinion yet.... kind of funny.

L.W. Baxter
03-20-2011, 06:38 PM
Ronald Reagan bombed Libya without congressional authorization. Or a U.N. resolution, even.

You are spitting in the wind, my friend.

Driver Mark
03-20-2011, 08:35 PM
Its so funny how ultra liberal papers/websites are reporting this ordeal like real journalists..... almost like they don't have an opinion yet.... kind of funny.


Yeah, almost like watching a liberal version of FOX NEWS. It's all "fair and balanced" depending on your own political bent.

perldog007
03-20-2011, 08:38 PM
Ronald Reagan bombed Libya without congressional authorization. Or a U.N. resolution, even.

You are spitting in the wind, my friend.

you are so insensitive, he said he would so he had to.

Phillip Allen
03-21-2011, 05:22 AM
There is no liberal justification for whats going on in Libya - They're just now finding out that their messiah is just like everyone else....
just now!?

I knew some years ago! (a Chicago politician, no less)

Roger Cumming
03-22-2011, 10:27 PM
Why is this a sad day? Moore has said many sensible things in the past. In fact most of what he has said that I heard was sensible.

ishmael
03-23-2011, 01:32 AM
That bit of our Constitution, where it is the Congress, a body of the people, that justifies going to war has been ignored for half a century. We don't call them warfare anymore, we call them police actions. One of the points of our founding documents was that you belly up to the bar. We've strayed from it in hazardous ways, from Vietnam right through the failures in Iraq and Afganistan.

We were justified going after Bin Laden, we were attacked, but almost everything after that is dicey and it shouldn't be up to the president.

PeterSibley
03-23-2011, 05:53 AM
Remember Rwanda ? I wish every damn soldier from every western country hand gone there . But we watched .Good TV though Bobby .

John Smith
03-23-2011, 06:56 AM
I"d like to see a few examples of Moore not making sense.

The present situation if ripe for Monday morning quarterbacks. I agree our constitution requires Congress to act. I also acknowledge that provision has been ignored by many presidents, sans any consequences.

Then, of course, there is the question about our participation in, and cooperation with the UN.

One could argue that Obama has inherited the time period where chickens are coming home to roost. At best, we are inconsistant with our policy of protecting the people from their leaders. Once can make a strong case that internal civil wars in other sovereign nations are not our business. One can also make a case that cooperating with the UN is our responsibility.

I maintain the UN involvement, being only humanitarion, is more of a problem than a solution. I believe they should draw a line; killing your own people is a criminal act, and authorize the taking out of any leader who does so. Equalizing the weaponry will insure, IMO, a longer, more bloody conflict. A UN coalition aurthorized to take out Qadaffi would be quicker and cheaper.

They would, however, need to be consistant with the drawing of that line.

ishmael
03-23-2011, 07:04 AM
Yeah, Rwanda Peter. There's a place where just a few platoons might have made a huge difference. And we sat on our hands. I say we, meaning Western forces. In our defense, I don't think the extent of the attrocity was well understood before it was over.

Steve Paskey
03-23-2011, 07:58 AM
Yeah, Rwanda ... In our defense, I don't think the extent of the attrocity was well understood before it was over.

Nonsense. Throughout the genocide, a small UN peacekeeping force known as the United Nations Assistance Mission in Rwanda (UNAMIR) operated in and around Kigali. They understood quite well what was happening. The Force Commander, Canadian Lt. Gen. Romeo Dallaire, immediately reported the situation to UN headquarters and BEGGED the UN to send in 5,000 troops. His request was denied. It wasn't until six weeks later that the UN approved sending in troops, but even then the Security Council's resolution did not clearly give them the authority to use force to save lives.

CK 17
03-23-2011, 08:50 AM
Last week when congress should have been discussing this they were talking about 5 million in funding for NPR. 200 million in missles went flying without their particapation. They're just as much to blame for this

Rick_NJ
03-23-2011, 11:33 AM
I am wondering why the West is not involved in the Ivory Coast. Seems like the West has selective memory when it comes to enforcing human rights. The democratically elected leader is not allowed to take power and the country is heading towards a civil war and the West is doing nothing. Maybe if the Ivory Coast discovered oil it might change things.

Gerarddm
03-23-2011, 12:29 PM
[QUOTE]Maybe if the Ivory Coast discovered oil it might change things.[QUOTE]

"We hold these truths to be self-evident". Unquote.

PeterSibley
03-23-2011, 04:58 PM
Nonsense. Throughout the genocide, a small UN peacekeeping force known as the United Nations Assistance Mission in Rwanda (UNAMIR) operated in and around Kigali. They understood quite well what was happening. The Force Commander, Canadian Lt. Gen. Romeo Dallaire, immediately reported the situation to UN headquarters and BEGGED the UN to send in 5,000 troops. His request was denied. It wasn't until six weeks later that the UN approved sending in troops, but even then the Security Council's resolution did not clearly give them the authority to use force to save lives.

Precisely , the whole enterprise stunk to high heaven .The most traumatised soldiers I have ever heard interviewed where the ''peacekeepers'' who were refused permission to defend civilians .Men women and children by the thousand chopped up in front of them .

Gadaffi was threatening to do exactly that to the rebels and seems entirely capable .

You like that idea Bobby ? or would it be better to stop a thug killing his own people ?

bobbys
03-23-2011, 05:14 PM
Precisely , the whole enterprise stunk to high heaven .The most traumatised soldiers I have ever heard interviewed where the ''peacekeepers'' who were refused permission to defend civilians .Men women and children by the thousand chopped up in front of them .

Gadaffi was threatening to do exactly that to the rebels and seems entirely capable .

You like that idea Bobby ? or would it be better to stop a thug killing his own people ?.

I do not like the idea your are stating a Red Herring Fallacy more specifically an Appeal to fear.

Examples.



"If you continue to drink, you will die early as your father did."
"If you cannot graduate from high school, you will live in poverty for the rest of your life."
"Voting for him is the same as voting for the terrorists."
"If you hate him, then you are no better than him.".

Yours...

If we do not stop him people will be chopped up by the Thousands..

Should we start Bombing all Countries with Dictators in case people will be chopped up?

What negotiations or sanctions were put forth before the Bombs started flying?.

How many are being killed by these Bombs?..

If the Prez said it was not meant to get him Who then?

seanz
03-23-2011, 06:48 PM
I liked the old Bobbys better. This RWW troll is tedious and insipid, bring back the roofin', fishin', redneck sockpuppet we know and love.

L.W. Baxter
03-23-2011, 07:22 PM
I liked the old Bobbys better. This RWW troll is tedious and insipid, bring back the roofin', fishin', redneck sockpuppet we know and love.

Seconded. Bobbys, the antidote to Norman etc. is not to do the same as him only from the opposite end. And you can't defend Sarah Palin from the vulgar partisans by cutting down somebody on the left. I understand the impulse, but it doesn't work that way. Political tripe is political tripe; the flavor doesn't matter.

It's your world, bobbys, do what you want, but you are boring the crap out of your friends here.

bobbys
03-23-2011, 08:19 PM
O, great its back to the bench again.

I swear Coach i can do this!!

Garret
03-23-2011, 08:35 PM
O, great its back to the bench again.

I swear Coach i can do this!!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTl-NnuLjaE

genglandoh
03-23-2011, 08:52 PM
In this case time was very important.
The rebels only had a few days before they were going to be wiped out.
I was very worried the UN resolution would not result in anything.

So I am not upset at the President supporting the no-fly zone.

I do think the President should have cancelled his trip to South America and stated his case for the Military action.