Expoxy - Re-use, throw away or clean up?

[Heifer Boy]

I’m building a camper box for the back of my ute/pickup and have been reading boatbuilding forums for ideas on joints and weatherproofing. Epoxy seems to be the way to go and so I’ve order a sample kit from BoteCote and have been experimenting. It’s good stuff and I’m getting a feel for it but it’s really messy so I would like some real world experience on re-use of tools and how to clean up. It’s not the most ‘eco’ product in the world but still don’t want to wash it all down the sink. I hope someone can help.

1) Can you clean brushes/roller/pots/trays/mixing sticks between jobs or do you just throw it all away? I’ve seen others lifting out dried epoxy from pots but it hasn’t worked for me using BoteCote supplied measuring cups. Brushes and mixing sticks isn’t too bad and I can wipe off using paper towels but I don’t want to throw away pots and rollers after every little job. What a waste.
2) All the info says ‘clean up with acetate’. How do you do this? Pour in a separate pot and soak brushes etc then rinse under water? Soak a paper towel and just wipe down? It’s a real mess.
3) When I’m glassing or barrier coating, how do keep brushes/rollers/pots usable between coats? I’m happy doing wet-on-wet but if I have to wait for the 1st coat to become tacky before 2nd coat etc then everything becomes tacky. I don’t want to be throwing things away between mixes.
4) Is it ok to mix a fresh batch of epoxy/glue into the same pot used for the 1st batch? What if there is some left over? Do I need to pour/wipe/wash it out before starting new?

All this is the biggest thing stopping me from using epoxy as a glue in particular. I’m thinking PU glue for the joints, fillet with epoxy when dry then glass and barrier coat after sanding. This seem a lot less wasteful unless I’m missing some easy clean up.

Thanks for all your experience.

[paul oman]

everything gets thrown away.. you can store/save epoxy work brushes for about 24 hours if you crudely clean of with one shot of solvent (getting excess epoxy off) and storing in freezer.

I use the same 'working bucket' until the layers of hard epoxy from past work sessions nearly fills the containers.

your first coat or two over the wood should be solvent thinned epoxy, then enamel or latex paint over that.

You could have used a water based epoxy for sealing and waterproofing.... easy water cleanup of everything!

email/message me for more details, if you want.

[Tom Robb]

If you mix in a flexible cup/pot you can squeeze the thing and get it to release.
Brushes are a lost cause in my book. Sticks can get reused after they kick off.
You're right, there's a lot to throw away. If your library has Geugeon on Boatbuilding, they (Googe Bros,) may have ideas you can use.
But!
Why does a camper need to be as water tight as a boat? It's a house on the back of your truck.
Build it like a house that expects hurricane force winds.

[JimConlin]

Brushes can be rinsed in acetone or other solvent. A minor residue is OK until the brush gets too stiff. I keep a covered jar of solvent for this. Cured epoxy wil flock out and the solvent lasts pretty well.
A brush with uncured epoxy can be held over in the freezer for maybe a day.
I'll re-use plastic pots for the next batch if it hasn't begun to kick. After the epoxy has cured, you can sometimes squeeze hard epoxy out without cracking the cup.
I don't re-use a plastic cup if there's cured epoxy in it. Bits of cured epoxy could detach and contaminate the new batch.
I buy plastic cups at a restaurant supply. A good 1 qt. pot (with lid) costs $.18.
For stir sticks, I use tongue depressors (<$.01) which get tossed or paint stir sticks (free at the big box) which get cleaned with the belt sander.

Don't solvent-thin epoxy for any reason unless you want it to be weaker. If you want epoxy to penetrate more, reduce its viscosity by warming the material being bonded.


I haven't heard of any respectable boatbuilder using water based epoxy. I wonder who might sell it.

[John Meachen]

Compared to the cost of epoxy,the cost of consumables is insignificant.You can use washed out yogurt cups as containers and mixing sticks are hardly in short supply around a wodworking project.I buy mixed packs of brushes for very little money and they are worth less than the solvent that would clean them.Rollers are a little more costly,so I buy kits that include two or three foam rollers with each handle and as they are only four inch rollers the total is modest.The benefits of epoxy ought to justify the outlay and a bit of planning can limit the total cost.

[The Bigfella]

Welcome. Since you want to waterproof it, I'm guessing you are a Queenslander? Take care up there.

As for consumables - I use Ski yoghurt containers for mixing... and make sure I sit them on a flat surface after the mixed glue is poured into another (larger container) - that way you can re-use them. I use whatever plastic container is around after the mix - eg ice cream containers for large mixes, chinese takeaway food containers for smaller mixes... the idea being to give more room for the powder mix, it doesn't matter that they aren't straight sided once the ratio has been established... and they are throw away.

You can use a wide scraper for spreading epoxy... although a brush is handy to get any ridges. Use it carefully then (when dry) cut off the stuck bit and get a second life out of that brush. Cheapies from Bunnings are the go.

I use paddlepop sticks for measuring. Work out how much mix you need, mark the stick then divide according to the glue ratio - thirds for Botecote, isn't it - ie 2:1 mix.

I've used hundreds of litres of epoxy this way and had zero cost for consumables other than brushes.... and they haven't cost much. I use foam rollers for coating sheets of ply.

[Jimmy W]

I clean up tools with white vinegar. It is cheap and does a good job on uncured epoxy. It will not clean stuff after the epoxy has cured. I re-use brushes after they have been cleaned with vinegar then rinsed out with soap and water and then dried. Roller covers, I just throw away.

[StevenBauer]

Yup. Stay away from acetone and other nasty solvents. Vinegar is all you need.

Steven

[Bob Adams]

I throw most stuff away, it I do need to clean uncured epoxy, I use denatured alcohol.

[botebum]

"Chip brushes" have skyrocketed in price but they're still the cheapest choice. Tongue depressors and clear, flexible, plastic pots. Vinegar cleanup for uncured epoxy.
Avoid acetone as much as possible. Get it on you or inhale it's fumes and it makes a beeline for your CNS. With prolonged exposure, in 20 or 30 years you'll be shaking like a leaf.

Doug

[Dutch]

I dont use plastic pots for expozy due to the exotherm- forget a batch and youll wind up with a meltdown and possible fire. soup and potted meat cans. number 10 cans from restaurants etc are a much safer choice. I can get a number of uses out of a chip brush with a tiny bit of acetone cleaning it- did a cost comparison and for about 15 seconds cleaning can save about 1/2 on chip brushes by cleaning them a few times and storing in slightly used acetone in a container covered with tin foil.

I used to use latex gloves but since I tried a box of the blue nitrile I use those now- I can quite often get 2 or 3 uses out of each glove if I am a bit careful.

Nothing wrong with using acetone if youre careful with it- I dont wash with it like one guy I used to work with - another I saw spill a cup on an electrical cord connection and it went up like fireball.

What do you guys that use vinegar do with it once it is used? pour it on the ground or into the sink? Acetone evaporates readily so it doesnt leave a toxic mess behind.

I have never bought mixing sticks- never- why buy something that takes a less than a minute or two with a table saw and piece of scrap lumber to make?


Only thing I dont reuse is roller covers, but I scrape the excess epoxy out of those before it cures and put it to use.

But Im a tight wad.

[TerryLL]

Everything gets thrown away. Chip brushes, mixing cups, plastic sheeting, roller covers. The one and only tool I use with epoxy is a small putty knife to clean off squeeze out. I let the epoxy set on the putty knife and chip it off the next day. No solvents used in clean-up.

I've found that mixing by weight using a digital scale is a good way to reduce the number of items contaminated with resin and hardener. No pumps, no measuring cups, just the one container that the batch gets mixed in. And if you need just a bit more you can put the used container back on the scale, tare it out, and mix up a new batch right on top of the remains of the first batch.

[Dutch]

just saw your question number 4- if youre fast enough its ok. but once epoxy starts to cross link and you introduce fresh epoxy and the old cross linking epoxy it speeds up the fresh epoxies reaction ie acts as a catalyst- youd be better off to start a fresh batch with a fresh pot if you think time to work the stuff is going to be a problem.

[Dutch]

I would be very careful of the measuring by weight method espeacially for large batches unless you are taking the specific gravity of both the epoxy and the hardner into account.

[KMacDonald]

Everything gets thrown away. Chip brushes, mixing cups, plastic sheeting, roller covers. The one and only tool I use with epoxy is a small putty knife to clean off squeeze out. I let the epoxy set on the putty knife and chip it off the next day. No solvents used in clean-up.

I've found that mixing by weight using a digital scale is a good way to reduce the number of items contaminated with resin and hardener. No pumps, no measuring cups, just the one container that the batch gets mixed in. And if you need just a bit more you can put the used container back on the scale, tare it out, and mix up a new batch right on top of the remains of the first batch.

Terry, thats the way I do it also. System three resin to hardener ratio of 100 to 44 by weight. Use the same mixing container over and over. I use alcohol to clean my putty knife.
When I’m glassing or barrier coating, how do keep brushes/rollers/pots usable between coats? You dont. Use new ones.
Is it ok to mix a fresh batch of epoxy/glue into the same pot used for the 1st batch? Yes, if the epoxy is still fluid in the pot.
Can you clean brushes/roller/pots/trays/mixing sticks between jobs or do you just throw it all away? No, just throw it all away except the mixing pots. You can usually pop out the cured epoxy from them.

[HarryH]

I find flat plastic containers housing small frozen dinners and desserts (like "Lean Cuisine", etc.) and such perfect for using epoxy in manageable batches....the relatively large surface area (as opposed to mixing cups) slows down cure rate. Easy to handle and tough to tip over. My family seems to eat way too much of this stuff, so they pile up when sorted from the trash..

For gluing strips, plank edges, etc., throw-away 1" chip brushes (Harbor Freight, about 19 cents ea.) trimmed to 1" length with scissors are just about right..

Also find Harbor Freight (not known for quality in most cases) a good source for throw-away nitrile or vinyl gloves....in fact, a good source for a lot of disposable materials...

I have some West plastic stirring/mixing sticks, which are re-usable by knocking off cured epoxy with a hammer..shatters and does not stick. Hard to beat cranking off a bazillion stirrers out of scrap on the band and/or table saw...then disposing after use....

I use vinegar and waterless hand-cleaner for cleanup, and try to avoid acetone. If you are particularly spooked about contact, coat hands with Vaseline before donning gloves...one more boundary should you ship a bit of goo under the gloves.

[SMARTINSEN]

I used to use latex gloves but since I tried a box of the blue nitrile I use those now

I agree with everything you wrote, but note that acetone will eat right through nitrile. They are great for epoxy, much tougher than latex or vinyl, but not for for more than just an incidental exposure to acetone. I use the thicker black butyl rubber gloves if I am going to be splashing around much in acetone.

I was good with used yogurt containers until SWMBO switched to Chobani. Their containers are a different--very thin and brittle--plastic that is not so good for mixing epoxy. I keep trying to get her to switch back to Stonyfield, but to no avail.

[TerryLL]

I would be very careful of the measuring by weight method espeacially for large batches unless you are taking the specific gravity of both the epoxy and the hardner into account.

Absolutely. The mix ratio by weight is not the same as the mix ratio by volume for the simple reason that the the resin and the hardener have different densities. I use System 3, which mixes at 44% hardener by weight and 50% by volume. The mix ratios are specified right on the bottle.

[Heifer Boy]

Brilliant stuff guys. I thought that the majority of answers were going to be 'throw away' but there are a few other options for bits and pieces to try out just to minimise waste were feasable.


But!
Why does a camper need to be as water tight as a boat? It's a house on the back of your truck.
Build it like a house that expects hurricane force winds.

A 'camper' is a bit of a simple description. I'm building a sealed box for the back of my 4WD ute that can withstand deep river crossings in the Victorian Highlands and The Kimberly, talc-like bulldust in the Outback, thousands of bone jarring corrogated dirts roads and monsoonal rains at 110kph. So it's not a boat but it will get a hammering. It will have a roof top tent attached too so will have a bit of leverage applied when offroad. My first box only lasted 2 years before leaking like a badly built boat so I'm doing it properly this time.

HB

[TerryLL]

Just a note about gloves. I use nitrile for everything except epoxy. For epoxy I use a very nice pair of long gauntlet industrial grade chemical gloves. They are expensive, but last for years, and protect that sensitive skin on your inner forearms. Hardened epoxy peels right off the next day.

[JimConlin]

My most-used tool for pushing epoxy around is the plastic bondo spreader.

http://multimedia.3m.com/mws/mediawebserver?mwsId=66666UuZjcFSLXTtNXM2LXfyEV76E bHSHVs6EVs6E666666--
In volume, they're inexpensive ($.50 each) and can almost always be re-used.
I toss sticky ones into a bucket and let them harden. When I've accumulated a bucketful, a vinegar soak completes the de-bonding and they're easily cleaned.

I've been using the same box (of 100) for ten years.

[wavewalker]

Gosh, I save plastic milk cartons which I cut in half for cups to mix all sort of things in. Cheap brushes, throw away after use. IMHO, I don't think that trying to save a few cents in used things is worth ending up with a bad batch mixture or grooved lines in the wet out because I used a brush, roller or squeege that wasn't quite cleaned perfectly. Add up the time of extra sanding and re doing into the equation and the so called waste is minimal.
WW

[John Meachen]

I would be very careful of the measuring by weight method espeacially for large batches unless you are taking the specific gravity of both the epoxy and the hardner into account.
I would seldom disagree with Dutch about practical matters.As he alludes,check the mixing requirements of your epoxy before committing to mixing by weight.Having verified the mix ratio and acquired a set of accurate scales,have at it.

[Welding Rod]

I put acetone in a metal paint can, chip brushes go in after use. Mix another batch of epoxy reuse the brush...

As long as the brush goes into the acetone before the epoxy starts to kick I can use it all day. With the tight fitting lid no fumes to speak of.

Rollers are disposable. to much work to clean.