Drill bit sharpening

[Ian Marchuk]

Over the years I always managed to a fairly good job sharpening my drill bits.
I use them most often to drill steel , and do lots of it.
That ability seems to be going by the way as my eyes are nowhere near as capable of seeing the finer edges , especially under 1/4 inch.
Do any of you have any comments regarding the effective value tools like "Drill Doctor" and the like , may have?
I've seen them around but I don't know anyone that has used one.
The "Drill Doctor" seemed to be a handyman sort of gadget , any recommendations of other brands?
A range up to 1" would be preferred , but up to 3/4 or 5/8 would be ok.
Ideas?

[boylesboats]

I wish that I know....
I can deal with tossin' 3/8" and smaller bits into trash once they're dull..
anything else larger is too costly to toss out..
I got several important sized bits larger than 1/2" up to 3/4" that I use for drillin' into steel plates.. and they are broken off at the tip... $20 a pop isn't good..

I don't know about sharpening Cobalt and Titanium bits..

Hopefully someone will come along shortly and give a thought on this

[goodbasil]

Buying titanium bits is a waste of time. The titanium is often put on a cheap, soft steel. Sure the stuff is hard but once it's dull the advantage is lost. and your first sharpening will be on soft steel. Titaniun is only a couple of thou thick. Its a sales gimmick, better off to buy uncoated in the first place.
As for the Drill Doctor, I was about to ask the same ? here myself, I think someone already has in the past. (Maybe it was me.)

[Soundman67]

Drill doctor comes in a couple of qualities. I tried the non self powered one first and really hated it. It was awkward and not very accurate. The powered version seems pretty good. has a Diamond abrasive so it will sharpen cobalt bits. reasonably accurate. any of my really good drill bits I take in with the router bits and have them sharpened by a pro. There is a great company in Vancouver at 4th and Quebec. but for sharpening on the fly when you know you are going to dull your drill bit over and over the Drill Doctor is a valuable piece of gear.

[Wooden Boat Fittings]

.
And I have an old hand-operated affair on eccentric wheels which, having fastened your drill in, you then roll over a flat sheet of the correct type of sand-paper. The wheels give the machine a rocking motion as it traverses the sand-paper, which caters to the curve on the end of the drill-bit. So many strokes on the first side, then you rotate the bit 180 deg and do the other side.

Surprisingly effective, but as I recall it only does bits between 1/8" and 1/2" diameter.

[Dave B]

I have one of the earlier model Drill Doctors and it works great! It's well worth the money for me.

[ssor]

40 years ago when I worked for Firestone we had a Milwaukee Machine Tool company drill sharpener that was a true marvel but it weighed about a ton and cost 4000 dollars in 1967

[Ron Williamson]

Weldingweb currently has a three page thread on the drill doctor.
R

[Ian McColgin]

There was a WB article on how to make a nice wooden jig that really works nice and fast if you treat your bits like you should treat any edge tool - frequent light touch sharpening leads to longer life than occasional major regrinding.

[pipefitter]

We had a couple of the manual drill doctors and they didn't seem to last. I think a good feature would have been a magnification window at the business end. They seemed to work well at first and then not so much. I have the same issue as you do, Ian, with failing eyesight. What I ended up doing is putting angle marks on the grinder rest and use a deft touch from the rear of the cutting edge up into the actual cutting edge just until I see sparks starting to pass over the edge. Most instances I can manage a good edge and in as many times, better than what the load of crap we get for bits comes with. I have a test scrap of aluminum that I use to measure the amount and type of swarf that each edge produces and touch up accordingly.

For anything precision on plate stock and pipe, I forgo the standard bits all together and use annular cutters for my most common sizes

[Bill R]

I'm happy with my older drill doctor. I'd certainly buy another one if this one ever dies.

[jonboy]

The problem I've found is if the drill has been worked too hard and gone blunt its almost certainly not going to hold its edge again.... got too hot, and lost its temper..... when the super brittle cobalts (one 8mm broke falling on to the tiled floor) and HSS break they can be sharpened but grinding the fracture back to shape for the sharpening gizmo takes so-oo long

Its a question of what your labour's worth....I don't mind messing about in the workshop but sometimes I think I've just spent an hour repairing this/ putting a new handle on whatever and honestly for mundane stuff like drills it's a fine line...

[Hughman]

I found one of these at a yard sale:

http://thumbs.ebaystatic.com/pict/360242820015_0.jpg

sears drill bit sharpener, works bolted next your bench grinder. it works reasonably well.

one problem with resharpening bits is uneven faces, which will cause an irregular hole, as in off size.

if that's critical, like sizing holes for your plug cutter, best buy a new one.

[dstreck]

Ian,

Which WB issue was the sharpening jig in?

[Jay Greer]

Sears sells the Drill Doctor and I am sold on it. I have run hundreds of dull drills through mine and it is still working very well. The tool is a good investment and time saver. Although the company makes a model that is of industrial strength, the plastic fantastic is good enough for me.
Jay

[Paul Pless]

Not very often that you here a ringing endorsement from a professional of something that Sears sells.

[Paul Pless]

one problem with resharpening bits is uneven faces, which will cause an irregular hole, as in off size.Is this true even in a drill press which essentially indexes off the drill bit's shank?

[gibetheridge]

http://www.mwells.org/_/rsrc/1236475568888/woodworking/sharpening/review---viel-tools-s5-belt-grinder/IMG_2314.JPG?height=420&width=315

I have sharpened hundreds of drill bits on one of these. It's a Viel Tools S5 1' x 42" belt sander, uses a 1/3 HP 1750 RPM motor (available from Viel Tools in Quebec, by phone.). I just do them by eye, following the original bevels as closely as possible, using a 320 grit aluminum oxide belt. For big broken off bits I start with zirconium 40 grit, then zirconium 80, then finish with the 320. Lee valley sells this tool, with the motor. Be sure to get the 1/3 HP, you'll want it for lawn mower blades, machettes, axes, hatchets and splitting malls, flattening rounded off chisels etc. It's one of the handiest tools I have ever owned, works much faster than a wheel.

Lee Valley doesn't sell it, I guess because it would compete with their more expensive gizmos, but you can get a kitchen knife attachment from Viel for this machine. Simplicity itself, for about $12.00, and it gives a better job than any other tool your going to run into, like razor sharp. Start off with the zirconium 80 grit to grind a 14 degree bevel on each edge, you'll know you've taken off enough when your can feel a burr down the full length of the edge. Then tip the jig up about 1 or 2 degrees by loosening the guide and pushing it upwards, taking the slack out of the sliding adjustment. Hone the edge at that approximately 16 degrees using a well worn 320 Aluminum Oxide belt, I guess once they're well worn they are about 600 grit. Then strop it on an old piece of canvas, no abrasive necessary, to remove any tiny remnant of burr. Use a light touch with each operation, a very light touch for the last 2 passes, a knife edge is very thin and cannot absorb much heat without turning blue, which ruins the temper. This is important. Another important thing....you will earn points with your wife when her knives are so sharp they will almost fall through a tomatoe.

There is no guard with the tool, it's easy to get a knife or whatever between the belt and the wheel, in which case you will get hurt very badly. You'll just need to be careful, or fabricate a guard.

I can't find a pic of the knife guide (Viel part # S9), but you can check it out at www.vieltools.com (http://www.vieltools.com). Call them and get their catalog, you'll enjoy looking through it.

I have earned tens of thousands of dollars with this machine, you can take my word for its efficacy (right word?).

Regarding the vision problem...maybe one of those big magnifying glasses on an extesion arm would be in order. They are available with attached flourescent bulbs, and they leave both hands free to work. Saving a couple of those bigger drill bits will repay the expense of the light.

I once read that HSS (high speed steel) is called that because you can use it at high speed and the resulting heat will not burn the tool. Any comments on that?

[boylesboats]

http://www.mwells.org/_/rsrc/1236475568888/woodworking/sharpening/review---viel-tools-s5-belt-grinder/IMG_2314.JPG?height=420&width=315.

look like knuckles grindin' bout to happen :eek:

[Canoeyawl]

Is this true even in a drill press which essentially indexes off the drill bit's shank?
Yes, it's true

A drill bit indexes off the chisel point. If it is off center and one cutting edge is longer than the other it will drill an oversize hole - Even in the best milling machine.
The bit will just flex.
In fact this is a "trick" to drill a slightly larger hole or a clearance hole if you don't have exactly the correct size bit. Simply grind one edge longer than the other.

(Three flute drills are more difficult to measure and sharpen than two flutes!)

[Ian Marchuk]

Thanks for the responses gents.
I only buy Walter bits in sizes up to 5/8". Above that size the only industrial supplier available locally is P&H, and they are not very good. Using a good cutting fluid sure adds life to the tool bit.

I was given some bits that came from a Boeing dispersal. Some were two stage. They had an initial pilot and up from the tip, the flute was shaped to cut the next stage. Those and some big old Dormer bits I've had forever are the last word in quality and speed. They hold an edge far longer than anything I have ever run accross. They aren't brittle and do not flake or chip. Sharpening bits is an industrial art ,as is using them. Like most cutting tools the good stuff is becoming harder to find , but well worth the search and the $. By far most of the drill bits out there on offer are a complete waste of hard earned cash.
I'd like to find a more effective way of maintaining the Dormer quality bits that I have and treasure.
Keep the feedback coming , I'll check in later. For now, I'm headed to the feathers after a 14 hour shift way far past where nowhere ends.
Rereading this post it strikes me that it is fairly discombobulated , I plead the fog of a tired and creaky body and synapses that are more pop than sizzle.
Best wishes all,
Ian

[PeterSibley]

I admit to using my eyecromater ,it works quite well after all these years practice.I also use a set of $30 jewellers lens to help dimming eyes see ,that and my vertical belt linisher ( shop built) do quite an acceptable job .

If I need absolute precision in wood I use a Forstener bit .

[Gold Rock]

I have what seems to be refered to here as a 'manual' drill doctor. Got mine about fifteen years ago. I'd say, all in all, it's a good tool. What I've experienced on the downside could be as much my fault as the tool's. The component that holds the bit, let's call it the chuck, has a series of cam profiles on it that, when inserted into the machine, move the bit in proper contact with the abrasive wheel as the chuck is rotated through 360 degrees. The aperture into which you insert the chuck has a capacity for movement that I believe is the basis for my occasional lack of total success. As the chuck is rotated in the aperture, I think a failure to maintain exact position of it's axis of rotation in relation to the abrasive wheel (which is hard to do really precisiely even if I'm concentrating) leads to a less than perfect grind on the point. This is exacerbated with smaller sized bits. I see evidence of this if I, say, (too) quickly sharpen a 3/16" bit and try to drill some steel plate. Occasionally it will provide almost no cutting action at all. If I reshapen the same bit very carefully, taking great care to hold the chuck very still and maintain very even pressure as I rotate, the same bit will make good shavings and pop through smartly. If I'm drilling wood the results are virtually always satisfactory. But in all, the machine is an asset in my shop. It just requires practiced use (what tool doesn't?) by me, and I deem it has paid for itself many times over for the cost of new bits.

[andrewe]

.
And I have an old hand-operated affair on eccentric wheels which, having fastened your drill in, you then roll over a flat sheet of the correct type of sand-paper. The wheels give the machine a rocking motion as it traverses the sand-paper, which caters to the curve on the end of the drill-bit. So many strokes on the first side, then you rotate the bit 180 deg and do the other side.

Surprisingly effective, but as I recall it only does bits between 1/8" and 1/2" diameter.

This sounds like my Eclipse sharpener, best value bit of kit ever. Near 30 yrs old, and still close to hand. Bigger than 1/2" I can still see well enough.
A

[jonboy]

Yes, it's true

A drill bit indexes off the chisel point. If it is off center and one cutting edge is longer than the other it will drill an oversize hole - Even in the best milling machine.
The bit will just flex.
In fact this is a "trick" to drill a slightly larger hole or a clearance hole if you don't have exactly the correct size bit. Simply grind one edge longer than the other.

(Three flute drills are more difficult to measure and sharpen than two flutes!)

Great tip!! never thought of that...will it work in steel too ?

[goodbasil]

But gib. LV does sell it.
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=44884&cat=1,43072
As Leonard Lee will tell you, it's his favorite knife sharpening tool, and he has access to everything.

[goodbasil]

Go to YouTube and type in drill bit sharpening. You may find something of interest there.

[floatingkiwi]

The Drill Doctor, in my opinion, is a great tool to have. When I use it I make sure it is all lined up and seated well and make slow deliberate moves , really "feeling" the diamond wheel as it cuts the steel.
Since using this thing, previously discarded dull bits are making their way back to the toolbox as sharp as they ever needed to be.
THe DD has paid for itself dozens of times over. I find it difficult to believe that I actually used to toss blunt bits out.

[gibetheridge]

But gib. LV does sell it.
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=44884&cat=1,43072
As Leonard Lee will tell you, it's his favorite knife sharpening tool, and he has access to everything.


GoodBasil,

Thank you for pointing this out.

I know I was not too clear about that. What I meant was that Lee Valley does not sell the knife sharpening guide, part # S-9, $10.95. I don't see it in the catalog I have here now, but I remember that I saw somewhere they showed the knife being held against the upper part of the belt without a guide. I do hold some tools up high and unbacked like that, the belt will depress and the edge will be rounded, the opposite of hollow ground. This is exactly what one wants for a striking tool like a hatchet, axe, maul or machette, but a kitchen knife should be flat ground.

Also, holding a knife up high on a 320 grit belt like that, with no support behind the belt, results in a lot of belt breakage, always quite startling, but never, so far, resulting in injury. The 320 belts are very thin and easy to cut into when unsupported, and once you get one worn down to about 600 grit, the best for honing after grinding, it's a pain to break the bugger.

I can't find a picture of the knife sharpening guide anywhere, so here's a photo of mine.

You can remove the wingnut on the right and use the exposed pin as a gude for grinding/honing lathe tools and carving chisels. Just remember, use sharp belts (except the worn 320 for honing) and a light touch. It helps to have a bucket of water handy for dipping. I have learned that if it's too hot to pinch and hold it's too hot.

I just can't tell you guys how useful this tool is, you should call them and get a catalog, their onlone catalog is not great. Their service is top notch.

No, I am not a salesperson for Viel Tools. I have the sharpening business here on Salt Spring. It's part time, due to the small population, but it helps, and it keeps me in circulation too. Also, I love always having sharp tools.

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4028/4526089700_b733be77f7.jpg

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4065/4526089044_8a62730813.jpg

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4059/4525459651_124ee9f2fc.jpg

[goodbasil]

Hi gib, it's Basil again.
Which way is your belt turning when you bring the edge to it? Up or down? Up seems to be the preferred way according to LL anyway. Of course we don't have to do it his way. Also, these 320 grit belts your using sounds a bit rough. Have you tried these?
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=1&p=48040&cat=1,43072
These are absolutely choice.

[andrewe]

Great tip!! never thought of that...will it work in steel too ?

Yep,as I have found if I rushed the sharpening in the middle of a job:o
A

[Canoeyawl]

Great tip!! never thought of that...will it work in steel too ?
It works in steel, yes.
I was speaking of metal work in particular.
Hell, wood is easy.
As far as a precision drilled hole there is really no such thing. In the machine shop world a drilled hole is always considered roughing work.
For a precision diameter you will need to drill and ream, use an end mill, or bore the hole.
I might sharpen a drill several times a day, or several times an hour depending on the material, and have never owned a drill sharpening jig. Some of the shops I've worked in had big (expensive!) machines that we would use on large bits over 5/8 say and for special applications, like odd angles, split point, crankshaft points or multi flute and hollow flood coolant type drill bits.
Everything else is done by eye - quick.

[gibetheridge]

Basil,

I learned long ago that it works far better if the belt is moving down, so long ago that I don't remember why, but that is the case.

I don't try to hone with a new 320. You're right, that's way too coarse, but once well worn they are just right.

I used to keep a few silicone carbide belts around for very fine polishing. A customer used to bring me his golf clubs to grind the dents out of (he would hit a rock from time to time) and I polished the work once it was done. He hasn't been around in a long while and I never replaced the belts because I never needed them for anything else. The abrasive is bonded to very thin paper/mylar, which breaks very easily. Shaving-the-hair-on-your-arm sharp is sufficient for most people, but when I want to do a little better than that I use a hard felt wheel and green jewelers rouge, both from Lee Valley.

So you're in Vancouver. If you're ever over on Salt Spring bring all of your knives, I'll do them up, no charge. You can email me through this forum, just click on the Yahoo icon.

[Jay Greer]

Not very often that you here a ringing endorsement from a professional of something that Sears sells.
Sears is just a seller of the tool, there are many other sources for the same tool.
Jay

[Paul Pless]

Basil,

I learned long ago that it works far better if the belt is moving down, so long ago that I don't remember why, but that is the case.
Probably because going down the belt presses the tool against the rest???

[gibetheridge]

Probably because going down the belt presses the tool against the rest???

Or at least it doesn't try to pull it up off of the guide.

[Wooden Boat Fittings]

This sounds like my Eclipse sharpener, best value bit of kit ever. Near 30 yrs old, and still close to hand. Bigger than 1/2" I can still see well enough.
A

Yep, Eclipse sounds about right I think, Andrew. And about the right age too. Bigger than 1/2" I'm with you too -- just do it by eye.

Mike

[goodbasil]

My blue Eclipse works fine too after about 30 years. Still got another one somewhere. new in the box.

[goodbasil]

I emailed LV about the belt. Your right gib, the belt runs downwards but the leather strop should run upwards.

Here is what they had to say.



As for which direction the belt runs for the Sander/Grinder (68Z7501), these instructions refer to the direction of rotation of the motor when viewed from the shaft end of the motor.



“When the motor is running, and you are facing the front of the Sander/Grinder, you want the belt to come over the top and down the front. This way the mass of the tool being sharpened helps to absorb the heat that is generated. This heat can quickly overheat the tool and reduce its hardness (except for High Speed Steel tools), which means having to sharpen it more often.”



The exception to this is when you are using a leather belt for honing. In this case you always want the belt moving away from the cutting edge to prevent cutting the belt. You can accomplish this by turning the tool so that the cutting edge is facing downwards. You can also simply go to the backside of the Sander/Grinder and then hold the tool with the cutting edge facing upwards. As a last resort, you can reverse the motor direction by reversing the RED and BLACK motor leads.



Regards,



Marc Charbonneau

Customer Service Representative

[gibetheridge]

Checking up on me, are you? You can save yourself the trouble, I don't shoot my mouth off unless I know what I'm talking about.

I never tried the leather belt since I already had the hard felt wheel. I expect it works just as well, but the wheel may have more uses. For instance, you can tuck the corner of the wheel into a v-groove carving tool. You need to make sure the wheel is turning away as well. I messed up once and almost ate a very sharp chisel.

Anyway, thanks for the affirmation.