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J P
04-12-2010, 03:27 PM
About a year ago I posted this thread (http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?t=94068&highlight=game) looking for info on trail cameras. I had seen some mountain lion sign on my property and wanted to try and get some pics. I ended up getting a Bushnell Trophy Cam last fall and have had it out pretty much non stop since then. Dang thing is still going on the first set of batteries!

I swap out the memory card every few days and look at what’s wandered into the sensors. Kinda fun this image ‘trapping’. I don’t use any attractants or bait of any kind, just trying to get a glimpse of the critters around the place doing their thing. Except one time I did hang up a feather in a branch hoping to entice a curious bobcat to come by (I’d seen its tracks in the snow) but it was a no-show.

So far lots of deer and elk, a skunk, packrat, magpie, chipmunk, bats? (strange blurs at night). Surprisingly no turkeys. I saw a bunch this weekend, think I’ll move the camera set. The tom’s are really active now.

Here’s a few random shots. Nothing too exciting.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y279/picsonline/TC01-1.jpg

A whitetail buck. Looking rather complacent, maybe wondering if that thing on the tree could be et.



http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y279/picsonline/TC05-1.jpg

Spike bull elk showing off his pointy bits.


http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y279/picsonline/TC06-1.jpg

Another young bull. Shame his rack got clipped in the frame, it would have made a nice 'stag in the misty morning woods' picture.


http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y279/picsonline/m_TC07.jpg

Cow elk, wondering about 'that thing' on the tree? Lots of critters come through this little notch.


http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y279/picsonline/m_IM000045.jpg

A bull going back up the notch.

.

Paul Pless
04-12-2010, 03:28 PM
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y279/picsonline/m_TC07.jpg

Cow elk, wondering about 'that thing' on the tree?


.


> :D

J P
04-12-2010, 03:30 PM
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y279/picsonline/m_IM000063.jpg

Cow elk going up at night.


And a little while later ... what I've really been waiting for! ....

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y279/picsonline/m_IM000065.jpg

Mountain lion.

George Ray
04-12-2010, 03:30 PM
Very interesting stuff....
perhaps you could educate on the state of the art and costs of trail cameras!

Paul Pless
04-12-2010, 03:32 PM
And a little while later ... what I've really been waiting for! ....

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y279/picsonline/m_IM000065.jpg

Mountain lion.

Wow!!! That'll make you think twice about wandering around alone, especially at night!!! Do you ever get the feeling you're being watched???:eek: :eek:

J P
04-12-2010, 03:34 PM
The lion was right in the same spot as that cow was and the same camera set. Just for fun I superimposed the pics to see the scale of the animals together.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y279/picsonline/m_elk-lion.jpg

ccmanuals
04-12-2010, 03:35 PM
Wow, amazing. is the camera motion sensitive?

J P
04-12-2010, 03:43 PM
Wow!!! That'll make you think twice about wandering around alone, especially at night!!! Do you ever get the feeling you're being watched???:eek: :eek:

No ****! And yes! :eek::D

When I went back to change the card in the camera the next day, believe me, I was a look'n over my shoulder ... and up in the trees ... and in the bushes ... And I was pack'n. ;) That spot is only 130 yards or so from the house.

Concordia...41
04-12-2010, 03:50 PM
No ****! And yes! :eek::D

When I went back to change the card in the camera the next day, believe me, I was a look'n over my shoulder ... and up in the trees ... and in the bushes ... And I was pack'n. ;) That spot is only 130 yards or so from the house.

Wow! And holy crap! :eek::eek:

Seriously, it's threads like this that serve as a reminder of what a wonderful thing this Forum is! :)

J P
04-12-2010, 03:57 PM
Very interesting stuff....
perhaps you could educate on the state of the art and costs of trail cameras!

About the extent of my experience: insert batteries, attach to tree, turn switch on, come back a day or two later, swap card, go home view card ... "hey, wow! come look at this!" :)


Wow, amazing. is the camera motion sensitive?

Yes, no idea how that works. Passive infrared (PIR)

Here's more info (http://www.bushnell.com/products/trail-cameras/trophy-cam/) on the model. There's lots out there to chose from. I researched enough to get befuddled and just picked one. I opted for the built in "viewer" but I'm not sure that was worth it, I can't make out a damn thing on it ... even when I remember to bring some reading glasses with me. :rolleyes:

I really should spend some time to experiment with it more.

leikec
04-12-2010, 04:04 PM
Quote - "When I went back to change the card in the camera the next day, believe me, I was a look'n over my shoulder ... and up in the trees ... and in the bushes ... And I was pack'n. ;) That spot is only 130 yards or so from the house."


Why be pack'n?

Get one of those laser mouse toys and make kitty play "chase the red dot".


Jeff C

elf
04-12-2010, 05:54 PM
Be kinda nice to get some light in there at night.

J P
04-12-2010, 06:02 PM
Be kinda nice to get some light in there at night.

Do you mean for better night pictures in general?

John B
04-12-2010, 06:16 PM
Wow. A camera like that in a relative/similar spot here would catch..... er, some boids .Maybe a pig, maybe a deer. On Kawau island , a wallaby.

Paul Pless
04-12-2010, 06:24 PM
Maybe a pig, maybe a deer.maybe a lemon thief:eek:

John B
04-12-2010, 06:34 PM
Ha.. you remember that, the fruit nickers.... funny. A camera like that would be a good urban study too wouldn't it.( there's an idea)

J P
04-12-2010, 06:40 PM
Wow. A camera like that in a relative/similar spot here would catch..... er, some boids .Maybe a pig, maybe a deer. On Kawau island , a wallaby.


maybe a lemon thief:eek:

:D:D I remember that too.


And they've got those cute little possums ... and stoats ... and hedgehogs. An underwater version of a trail cam would be cool.

Paul Pless
04-12-2010, 06:47 PM
An underwater version of a trail cam would be cool.I fished on an offshore charter boat that had something similar to this rigged to their outriggers and 'trolled' the camera about 2 to 3 feet ahead of the lure. They cost about $200.00 now.

http://images.cabelas.com/is/image/cabelas/s7_019011_imageset_02?$main-Large$

John B
04-12-2010, 07:30 PM
There's a local fishing show that uses a camera like that... there's been some phenomenal footage over the years.

Matt Watson, the fishing show (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjdEohdYcvQ)

That one is just the first one off the youtube search but its worthwhile looking at the rest when you have time.

The rest (http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=matt+watson++fishing+show&aq=f)

bluedog225
04-12-2010, 07:43 PM
That's great. Any idea how long it would take for the memory card to fill up? I've got some land I don't get to more than once a month.

MiddleAgesMan
04-12-2010, 07:54 PM
Seems like an inexpensive way to provide surveillance of a construction site.

I'm confused about the night shots--the write up says there are 24 LEDs so that 'game isn't scared away'.... It seems a flash of any kind is going to surprise and, perhaps, scare wild game. It would certainly give human intruders something to think about.

BrianW
04-12-2010, 08:06 PM
Those are great.

Especially the superimposed image!

Thanks!

bobbys
04-12-2010, 08:14 PM
Neat thread.

I heard some young guys say they set up cameras off season to find out where the big bucks are.

I think its illegal to do it during hunting season but not sure.

The wind blows pretty hard here would that set the Camera off to much?.. Would someone steal the camera or do you set it off in a secluded spot?

paladin
04-12-2010, 08:31 PM
The LED's are infra red. The camera electronics are sensitive to IR light. You could rig more led's up with a small battery pack to trigger when the main unit goes off and get more available light. There's several companies that sell led lights for that application.

ChaseKenyon
04-12-2010, 08:49 PM
The lion was right in the same spot as that cow was and the same camera set. Just for fun I superimposed the pics to see the scale of the animals together.


unless guarded by a bull, that cow would be a few days meals without too much trouble for the "Kitty"!!!!!

Bill R
04-13-2010, 06:02 AM
Amazing. Thanks!

The Bigfella
04-13-2010, 06:23 AM
Brilliant.

Iceboy
04-13-2010, 07:07 AM
I have one set up most of the summer into fall. I really like this series of pictures. I had the camera set to take one picture at the same time every day and also to take a picture of any movement.

http://http://www.flickr.com/photos/iceboy133/4517167911/in/photostream/

Iceboy
04-13-2010, 07:32 AM
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2769/4517167911_c8f62d3ce7.jpg

Iceboy
04-13-2010, 07:35 AM
Okay figured that out again. that was the daily photo. The next one you can see someone looking into the camera. For some reason bears always check them out when I first hang them.
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4006/4517167939_2f434612cf.jpg

Iceboy
04-13-2010, 07:37 AM
Here is the next photo later that day. As you can see the bear didn't care for my viewing setup.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2720/4517801718_64e285d2bf.jpg

J P
04-13-2010, 08:10 AM
Those are great Iceboy!

I was hoping someone else would put up some pics ... thought I was going to have to dig out my chipmunk pic. :D

What's your thinking for the daily shot?

J P
04-13-2010, 08:20 AM
That's great. Any idea how long it would take for the memory card to fill up? I've got some land I don't get to more than once a month.

It would depend on the camera and card and how you set it up; resolution, number and time between shots, etc. I wouldn't think you'd have any trouble going a month. Longest I've gone is a couple weeks on a vacation and when I got back I couldn't wait to pull the card and see what was on there. Like a kid at christmas!

J P
04-13-2010, 08:42 AM
Seems like an inexpensive way to provide surveillance of a construction site.

I'm confused about the night shots--the write up says there are 24 LEDs so that 'game isn't scared away'.... It seems a flash of any kind is going to surprise and, perhaps, scare wild game. It would certainly give human intruders something to think about.

Apparently the IR flash is imperceptible and doesn't seem to spook them at all.


The LED's are infra red. The camera electronics are sensitive to IR light. You could rig more led's up with a small battery pack to trigger when the main unit goes off and get more available light. There's several companies that sell led lights for that application.

No, YOU could rig that. :) I should look into it though as a lot of the interesting stuff, especially with the predators, goes on at night. I've noticed that it's tricky getting a setup that yields 'decent' shots with the flash. I imagine some extra flanking lights would help immensely.

Bruce Taylor
04-13-2010, 08:43 AM
Wonderful! Thanks for posting, JP.

The pics on your critter cam are a lot bigger than the ones on mine. ;)

J P
04-13-2010, 08:52 AM
Wonderful! Thanks for posting, JP.

The pics on your critter cam are a lot bigger than the ones on mine. ;)

Not as scary either. Yours give me nightmares. ;)

Iceboy
04-13-2010, 09:25 AM
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2783/4518079638_07be469a5e_o.jpg
Those are great Iceboy!

I was hoping someone else would put up some pics ... thought I was going to have to dig out my chipmunk pic. :D

What's your thinking for the daily shot?

I originally set up the daily shot when my older game cams did not time and date stamp. Having one taken at a certain time let me guess with shadows etc.

I have no problems with the deer spooking because of the IR flash. With regular flash they would spook at first but if I left the camera there they would become used to it and ignore it.

I regularly leave them out for a month or more without checking them. If you have a large memory card they can go a long time.http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4007/4518079604_325b414877_o.jpg

Iceboy
04-13-2010, 09:28 AM
Those last two pictures are taken with the camera strapped to the bottom rungs of my ladder stand. I was in the stand and watched them for about an hour. I guess my scent control program works.

J P
04-13-2010, 09:33 AM
Neat thread.

I heard some young guys say they set up cameras off season to find out where the big bucks are.

I think its illegal to do it during hunting season but not sure.

From the regs in Montana:


Motion-Tracking Devices and/or Camera Devices

It is illegal for a person to possess or
use in the field any electronic or camera
device who’s purpose is to scout the
location of game animals or relay the
information on a game animal’s location
or movement during any Commission adopted
hunting season.
Seems to be a controversial issue amongst some of the hunting crowd.



The wind blows pretty hard here would that set the Camera off to much?.. Would someone steal the camera or do you set it off in a secluded spot?

Blowing hot air might set it off. :D Actually wind can be a problem and cause false triggering. I had one setup where there was some grass in front of the camera and I got about 176 pictures of ... grass ... back and forth ... I kept looking through the pics trying to find a mouse or something before I figured out that it probably was just the wind. Would you like to see my pictures of the wind? Got lots of em. ;)

Security of the camera itself wasn't a big issue for me as I only intended to use it on my own property (though I can see taking one camping). The cam I have isn't really set up for security, but a lot, if not most, of them are by using steel cables and locks. A determined person could still nab one, or smash it, but I'd hope they would think twice before attempting either; like, hmm maybe there's another camera out there watching this one. Probably giving the criminal mind too much credit though, eh.

Iceboy
04-13-2010, 09:37 AM
Neat thread.

I heard some young guys say they set up cameras off season to find out where the big bucks are.

I think its illegal to do it during hunting season but not sure.

The wind blows pretty hard here would that set the Camera off to much?.. Would someone steal the camera or do you set it off in a secluded spot?

I set them up for that purpose and it is legal to keep them out during hunting season.

I also set them up to catch some tresspassers who come on my property for timber theft.

The wind will set them off if there are branches waving around in the sensors range. There is a targeting LED that lets you set up the sensor to avoid that problem.

I haven't had mine stolen yet. I have had one camera take a picture of a tresspasser messing with a decoy camera I put out to discourage them. Cost him $2200 for coming on my property and destroying the decoy because he thought it took his picture. You can also buy a bear safe for them so the only way to steal them is to cut down the tree.

Iceboy
04-13-2010, 09:40 AM
Funny that we cross posted JP. Criminals don't think at all. Earlier I had one cheap cam smashed by an intruder. Dumb ass didn't take the memory card with him. Cost him a piece of change as well. :)

J P
04-13-2010, 09:49 AM
Funny that we cross posted JP. Criminals don't think at all. Earlier I had one cheap cam smashed by an intruder. Dumb ass didn't take the memory card with him. Cost him a piece of change as well. :)

Too funny. :)

Shame you/we have to deal with that kind of crap though. Dumb asses.

ron ll
04-13-2010, 01:13 PM
Spin_Drifts pics from a while back.

http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?t=89446&highlight=trail

J P
04-13-2010, 01:14 PM
Surprisingly no turkeys. I saw a bunch this weekend, think I’ll move the camera set. The tom’s are really active now.


I got to thinking about this: Spring turkey season opened here this past Sunday. If, in the unlikely event I dispatched one for the freezer, would it be illegal to have the camera out operating somewhere nearby, whether intended to photograph turkeys or anything else? I looked in the turkey regs and it doesn’t have the clause about camera/motion detector use like the big game regs has. Interesting because the other similar restrictions prohibiting use of recorded sounds, two-way communication, artificial lights, bait, etc. are all there.



Iceboy, any turkey in your neck of the woods? They seem to be doing quite well around here since they were introduced. Certainly less controversial than the wolf re-introduction.

J P
04-13-2010, 01:17 PM
Those were awesome Ron II, I remember that thread, thanks for posting the link. I can only imagine how that guy must have reacted when he checked his card.

Iceboy
04-13-2010, 01:33 PM
There are quite a few turkeys around here. The properties where my cameras are located are in the northwestern part of Wisconsin. There are few turkeys there and the land is not really good habitat for them. We also have several wolf packs in the area and though I have seen them while hunting I have yet to get one to trigger a game cam. They also have spotted a cougar going into my property twice in the last few months. I don't have a cam there yet this year but hope to soon. The Dept of Natural Resources swore there were none here in spite of several sitings. Then last year some guys with dogs treed one near there and took pictures. When the DNR doubted the pictures they treed it again and had the wildlife biologist come out to explain what they treed. Seems the biologists around here spend more time in thier offices than in the woods.

J P
04-13-2010, 02:16 PM
I saw some wolves on a neighbor’s property about a year ago. I’m wondering if there isn’t a pack around now. The elk seem to be sticking around and last evening a group of around 40 whitetail came through. Never seen a herd that big around my place. There’s usually lots of them around but not together like that. There’s no alphalfa fields or the type of habitat where you would typically see larger groups. After the next fresh snowfall I should take a walkabout, have a looksee.

J P
04-13-2010, 02:44 PM
There's a local fishing show that uses a camera like that... there's been some phenomenal footage over the years.

Matt Watson, the fishing show (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjdEohdYcvQ)

That one is just the first one off the youtube search but its worthwhile looking at the rest when you have time.

The rest (http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=matt+watson++fishing+show&aq=f)

Interesting videos John, I’ll have to watch some more of those.



Speaking of cameras and predators and sharks … When we were kayaking at Stoney Bay in Feb. I saw a fin tip coming straight at me. Gulp. Brief oh**** moment, thinking it’s really true what they say about yumyum yellow, the color of my boat. Then the tail tip came up and I could see it was probably only about 4-5ft long. Started fumbling for my little waterproof camera thinking I’d stick my hand in the water and snap a pic as it cruised by. Tourists ya know.:o Couldn’t do it. Thought, if that thing is curious/bold enough to swim by within 8 feet, it might just go all agro from a flash attached to a noodley appendage. Turned out to be a little hammerhead.

Out there kayaking we had talked about the idea of having a camera under the boat to see what was ‘down there’, decided it might be better not to know. :eek:

Paul Pless
04-13-2010, 04:45 PM
There's a local fishing show that uses a camera like that... there's been some phenomenal footage over the years.

Matt Watson, the fishing show (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjdEohdYcvQ)

That one is just the first one off the youtube search but its worthwhile looking at the rest when you have time.

The rest (http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=matt+watson++fishing+show&aq=f)
Some phenomenal out of the water video of marlin jumping on those clips too!

Love to hear those reels sing!!!

John B
04-13-2010, 04:55 PM
Out there kayaking we had talked about the idea of having a camera under the boat to see what was ‘down there’, decided it might be better not to know.

Remember my shark story from last year. That was a mako of conservatively 2-2.5 m and some swore 3 m (10 ft) a good 5 or 6 ft aerial about 15 ft in front of the boat at anchor. Kids and Kirsty had just got out of the water.

moral: it didn't want human for dinner.

Phillip Allen
04-13-2010, 05:05 PM
There are quite a few turkeys around here. The properties where my cameras are located are in the northwestern part of Wisconsin. There are few turkeys there and the land is not really good habitat for them. We also have several wolf packs in the area and though I have seen them while hunting I have yet to get one to trigger a game cam. They also have spotted a cougar going into my property twice in the last few months. I don't have a cam there yet this year but hope to soon. The Dept of Natural Resources swore there were none here in spite of several sitings. Then last year some guys with dogs treed one near there and took pictures. When the DNR doubted the pictures they treed it again and had the wildlife biologist come out to explain what they treed. Seems the biologists around here spend more time in thier offices than in the woods.

Funny...they spend a lot of energy denying they're any here too. I suppose they figure the public will over react and demand the extermination of the critters

Kaa
04-13-2010, 05:27 PM
Speaking of cameras and predators and sharks … When we were kayaking at Stoney Bay in Feb. I saw a fin tip coming straight at me. Gulp. Brief oh**** moment, thinking it’s really true what they say about yumyum yellow, the color of my boat. Then the tail tip came up and I could see it was probably only about 4-5ft long. Started fumbling for my little waterproof camera thinking I’d stick my hand in the water and snap a pic as it cruised by. Tourists ya know.:o Couldn’t do it. Thought, if that thing is curious/bold enough to swim by within 8 feet, it might just go all agro from a flash attached to a noodley appendage. Turned out to be a little hammerhead.

Speaking of oh-**** moments, a well-known picture:

http://www.universalocean.es/wp-content//shark-kayak.jpg

:-)

Kaa

purri
04-14-2010, 12:26 AM
We had a 6 foot thresher shark come through the beach last summer. (Sydney Harbour/ Port Jackson). No-one raised a sweat.

George.
04-14-2010, 11:03 AM
Kaa, is that photoshop or not?

George Jung
04-14-2010, 01:27 PM
I tried 'snopes', without luck. I recall the same question on kayakforum last year;; it's my understanding, this one is 'real', though the perspective makes the shark look larger than it is (but still bigger than the kayak).

Remember the video of the killerwhale breaching and landing on the kayaker - who then rolled up, and continued on his way? That was from a commercial, as I recall - not the real deal.

Kaa
04-14-2010, 01:44 PM
Kaa, is that photoshop or not?

That's not Photoshop.

Snopes: http://www.snopes.com/photos/animals/sharkkayak.asp

Some background and more pictures: http://www.abc4explore.com/whitesharks/sharkyshores.html

Kaa

Phillip Allen
04-14-2010, 03:32 PM
well...I thought it was prolly photoshopped

George.
04-15-2010, 07:56 AM
Question: is that camera durable? Even in a rainy, humid spot?

I'd also like to hear what Kaa and others think of the image quality.

Iceboy
04-15-2010, 08:45 AM
Question: is that camera durable? Even in a rainy, humid spot?

I'd also like to hear what Kaa and others think of the image quality.

Mine certainly is durable. It has sat in the woods during rain, hail ,snow, subfreezing temps and I even dropped it in swamp water once. I think it would work fine in Brazil:)

Here is a link to the owners manual for the ones I have. http://www.cuddeback.com/images/pdfs/NoFlash_7_11_07.PDF

Jim...

Iceboy
04-15-2010, 08:48 AM
Also, just to clarify, the last two bear pictures I posted were taken with budget $50 game cams. The trigger speed on those is really slow and the picture quality isn't as good.

Kaa
04-15-2010, 10:10 AM
I'd also like to hear what Kaa and others think of the image quality.

Image quality is relative to the purpose of the picture. JP's camera seems good enough to to show stuff to friends/relatives and generate OOOH! sounds :-) It may make an adequate 4x6 print. I strongly doubt it will make an adequate 8x10 print. Hard to say, really, without looking at out-of-the-camera originals -- pictures posted here were resized for the screen.

But then you can see the same pictures I see and can make your own judgment whether the quality is acceptable to you.

Kaa

George.
04-15-2010, 10:32 AM
Yes, I can make my own judgement, but not know if it will print well, if it is considered to be up to current standards, etc. For that I rely on the Bilge. :)

huisjen
04-15-2010, 02:46 PM
Regarding scent lures for big cats: I heard about a program in the Pacific Northwest where they were trying to collect DNA from big cats. They had a bit of carpet with nails sticking through, dosed with a bit of cougar urine. The idea was that the target cat would try to mark over the scent by rubbing with facial scent glands, and in the process would leave a few hairs on the nails. But at one point a field researcher accidentally spilled his soda on the lure, and they found that that lure was amazingly more successful than the urine scented lures. Amazingly, yes, Coca-Cola is even better than cougar piss.

Dan

J P
04-15-2010, 04:37 PM
The image quality from the camera I have is about what I expected, not great, but not too bad, and has been adequate for my purposes. There are better ones and worse ones to choose from.

Other than placement there isn’t much one can do to control the shots. I’ve noticed that it’s pretty easy to get overexposed images in bright contrasty settings. I don’t really understand how the focus is setup on mine yet. I know this type of camera isn’t intended for very close shooting but sometimes it seems to do better in the closer ranges than at other times. Like the second pic in this thread, the spike elk’s neck hair seems like it is starting to get into focus, somewhat, where a lot of times anything that close would be even blurrier.

I know some cameras are setup for close in work. That would be fun to have too for things like setting up near a critter’s burrow entrance or a bird nest. I’d want a 'good' one for that kind of shooting though.

Another thing to look at is trigger speed. I think mine is 1 second. I get quite a few ‘blank’ images that I assume are from birds or small rodents zipping by.

This camera seems reasonably durable but I haven’t done anything with it other than strap it to a tree or prop it on a rock. It’s been out trough one Montana winter, albeit a mild one. I did bring it in once when temps were going below 0* F. I think it’s rated to 5 below, whatever that means.

J P
04-15-2010, 04:49 PM
Regarding scent lures for big cats: I heard about a program in the Pacific Northwest where they were trying to collect DNA from big cats. They had a bit of carpet with nails sticking through, dosed with a bit of cougar urine. The idea was that the target cat would try to mark over the scent by rubbing with facial scent glands, and in the process would leave a few hairs on the nails. But at one point a field researcher accidentally spilled his soda on the lure, and they found that that lure was amazingly more successful than the urine scented lures. Amazingly, yes, Coca-Cola is even better than cougar piss.

Dan

Interesting Dan, never heard that one. I don't drink the stuff. Coca-Cola neither.

leikec
04-15-2010, 05:09 PM
Quote - "Interesting Dan, never heard that one. I don't drink the stuff. Coca-Cola neither."


That stuff will rot your teeth out.

Jeff C

John B
04-16-2010, 12:41 AM
Ha..

octopus steals camera (http://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/cutestuff/3590839/Octopus-flees-with-camera)