Bolger's Manatee (Alert)

[colin_p]

Is anyone out there familiar with this boat ? Curious how, amongst so many Bolger designs, only one of these has been built. According to: http://www.atomvoyages.com/articles/Alert.htm the Manatee's beam is under 8 feet. Does anyone know for sure how much under 8 ft ? If it were possible to scale this boat down to a beam of 6' 10" (those in the UK will know the significance of this measurement !) then I'm all for building a second one.

Possibly the only problem I have with the standard design is the headroom, which ideally I'd like to raise to 6' 6" (yes, I know ... but if you were 6' 4" with a scalp full of scars ...) along the full length of the cabin, in the central 2-3 feet of that area. One way of achieving this without creating mega windage might be to raise the camber of the cabin roof to semi-circular, together with a 'V'-ing of the hull bottom. The above link states that the ballast of this boat is in the form of a 6" square external lead keel some 19 ft long - I was thinking of making the bottom of the boat from sheet steel (to achieve the same ballast), 'V'-eed to make it 6" deeper in the centre. But - is this going to change the hull characteristics significantly ? At the very least there would be some ballast in the ends which ain't brilliant.

If anyone know about this boat, or has access to the study plans, or has any constructive ideas of how I might turn Manatee into a full-time canal-cruising, occasional trip-across-to-Holland/ France type of boat, then I'd very much appreciate hearing from them.

Alternatively, does anyone know from where I might buy the Manatee plans ?

Regards

Colin

[Wild Dingo]

Actually Colin I believe its been built more than once... I read a book on coastal camping and cruising by an american couple (whos names escape me) I believe the womans name is Ida but the blokes escapes me and as the book went the way of most of our gear I cant refer to it but...

The built one and sailed it all along the coast of the US as it suited the coastal cruiser lifestyle better than anything else they had found... Dont know if they are still sailing it but if my memory serves they were when the book was published

Anyway mate all the best shes really a beauty as are many of Bolgers designs... have you seen his St Valery yet? stunning!! :cool:

[colin_p]

Good to hear that someone else has recognised and built a good design !!

At the risk of offending fans of Bolger, I normally can't stand his slab-sided designs - purely an aesthetic matter - I'm sure they hold up ok - it's just they don't rest easy with my eyes.
But with Manatee, the rounding of the sections fore and aft, plus the lee-boards 'disguising' the mid sections - well, to my eyes it looks good.

Perhaps I'll become a full Bolger convert in time ?

Cheers

Colin

[PVanderwaart]

Sorry to say, I think you are heading in the wrong direction.

The original idea (as best I understand) was to hold the beam down to the legal road width in the US. At that narrow beam, the boat needed a lot of ballast for the required stability. I'm not sure to what extent the low sides (and lack of headroom) was also to improve roadworthiness, and how much was for stability reasons, but I believe that Bolger was not in favor of the cabin trunk added to Alert.

Making the boat narrower, raising the roof and raising the ballast all work together in the wrong direction. Keep in mind that a 30' sailboat of normal form may have a beam of 10' and marginal standing headroom.

The boat you want may be possible, but I think it needs to be engineered from a clean page. It may have standing headroom, but only in a limited area not swept by the booms of a divided rig. It will heel a lot while sailing upwind. But possible.

[Stu Fyfe]

Bolger can design beautiful boats. He usually designs them for other reason. Here's my Redwing, design #328
http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid147/pfa188e7e8c0a4a77ff04180e61dc140e/f6231af0.jpg

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid149/p59dac335a0bdd3b7680cbcd98162aa73/f5feb71e.jpg
Phil and Suzanne at last year's WoodenBoat Show.

[Wild Dingo]

Lovely Stu... and for the nay sayers on Bolger anyone remember the ROSE?? mmmm?? one hell of a take on a Brigatine (IMMS) by gar

And the St Valery...

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid65/p387bd73d6cae74a89718f77f5e27996f/fbf7c1dd.jpg

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid65/p5ba2ccd903f94a61763b81b0e47779df/fbf7c1da.jpg

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid65/p7dbb4fde5016d411440c3d38eeca74d2/fbf7c1cf.jpg

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid65/pd92fd6416a07dd6dd7fc8c8fa8ac1ed6/fbf7c1cc.jpg

No one can call her a "slab sided box" surely?? Sorry mate but I cant abide it when someone says the slab sided comment with regard to one who is arguably one of the most diverse and talented NAs around and so must show St. Valery in her glorous beauty

THANK GAWD FOR IMAGESTATION!!!

[Stu Fyfe]

More eye-pleasing Bolger designs.
http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/cabs4.jpg
Black Skimmer
http://www.instantboats.com/images/billtinycat2300.jpg
Bob Cat
http://www.ace.net.au/schooner/spartina.jpg
Spartina
http://www.friend.ly.net/~dadadata/boat/chebacco.jpg
Chebacco
http://www.tallshiprose.org/illustrations/front/Head.jpg
Rose

[Meerkat]

6'10" eh? After the recent inconveniences, I don't think one will be allowed to take one's boat through the tube any more... ;)

[Jeremy Burnett]

The plans for Manatee appear in the book "Different Boats" by Bolger.Published by International marine.

[Venchka]

I have Ida Little's book. I'll re-read it. As I recall, the boat they had built needed a lot of re-working after launching.

Wayne
In the Swamp. :D

[colin_p]

Thanks - I very much appreciate your reply.

I did say "scale the boat down to a beam of 6'10" - by this I meant 'scale all dimensions down' until a beam of 6'10" is reached - which would give a length of around 27 ft.
But I accept your comments in the main. It looks like I'll be sticking to a beam of 8ft - although not religiously - which means being restricted to the broad-gauge canals in Britain.
Oh well - no-one said life was perfect.

It also looks like a box keel (open along 6 foot or so of it's length) may be the only solution to achieving the desired headroom. I'll drop Phil Bolger a line and see what he thinks. I'm mindful that boats like Gunning's Cormorant (for example) has headroom of 6ft on a beam of 8' 9". So I think my proposed scheme might be possible with some ingenuity.
Colin

[ 07-14-2005, 10:46 AM: Message edited by: colin_p ]

[sr. jigaboni]

I've been off the web for a while, and I'm not coming back... this is the only thing I miss. But, Phil has been bending over backward to help my wife and I in our quest for a dream boat, and they all look a little weird. At the same time, they are all quite lovely. He is an anachronism in that he is classic and modern at the same time. By the way (see how net illiterate I am), the design we decided on is the Amherst Galley. Pretty. Weird. I think it should fit in a canal, too, and it has a lot of standing headroom, sorta.
I'll try hard to have a nerdy friend post pictures when we start building it...next spring (boats cost a lot of money, you know)

peace

rigo

[Wild Dingo]

Well Rigo me ol cobber! how have you been? So where are the pics the "nerd" should have posted by now? Id appreciate a look at the final choice of design he did for you if possible

Thanks in advance

[sr. jigaboni]

He didn't make it for me. He made it for a school based camping/boating program thing, which gives the boat its name (I think the deal is called Amherst View). Write Phil and ask for info on the Amherst Galley and he will inundate you with literature... lots of pictures and specs.

It's not your typical boat, but it has an old fashioned feel to it. And, it's a gaff schooner.

I've been "outfitting" my house for her voyage to someone else's conscience. I've also been working alot. Look at all these freedom chips, wish I was free...