View Full Version : Hugo Chavez claims US set off Haitian quake deliberately

01-26-2010, 05:56 PM
I did not know we had an earthquake weapon.


Venezuelan media “added that the U.S. government’s HAARP program, an atmospheric research facility in Alaska (and frequent subject of conspiracy theories), was also to blame for a Jan. 9 quake in Eureka, Calif., and may have been behind the 7.8-magnitude quake in China that killed nearly 90,000 people in 2008,” Fox News (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,583588,00.html) reported on Thursday.

01-26-2010, 06:00 PM
You heard it first on Fox.

01-26-2010, 06:08 PM
He's been watching too many movies.....

01-26-2010, 07:45 PM
He's been watching too many movies.....

Its not his fault. They lose a lot in the Spanish translations.

Paul Fitzgerald
01-26-2010, 07:48 PM
If he had kept his foil hat on he would have realised it was those pesky aliens again ....

01-26-2010, 08:01 PM
I thought it was Bushes fault.

Bob Triggs
01-26-2010, 08:17 PM
Just another stupid attempt to make the man look as bad as possible.

01-26-2010, 08:38 PM
Yep, all us geologists were aiming the new rocks gizmo at Venezuela and done missed. Sorry.:o

01-26-2010, 08:44 PM
I knew it all along.

01-26-2010, 08:51 PM
I thought it was Bushes fault.

Technically it was. And that's not how to spell 'Bush's'.

Bob Smalser
01-26-2010, 09:00 PM
Chavez is taking a que from the Obama adminstration in creating distractions from the fact that his world is beginning to crash down around his ears.


How Hugo Chavez's revolution crumbled

By Jackson Diehl (http://projects.washingtonpost.com/staff/articles/jackson+diehl/)
Monday, January 25, 2010

While the world has been preoccupied with the crisis in Haiti (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/world/haiti-earthquake/index.html), Latin America has quietly passed through a tipping point in the ideological conflict that has polarized the region -- and paralyzed U.S. diplomacy -- for most of the past decade.
The result boils down to this: Hugo Chávez's "socialism for the 21st century" has been defeated and is on its way to collapse.

During the past two weeks, just before and after the earthquake outside Port-au-Prince, the following happened: Chávez was forced to devalue the Venezuelan currency (http://english.eluniversal.com/2010/01/09/en_ing_esp_venezuela-implements_09A3268691.shtml), and impose and then revoke massive power cuts in the Venezuelan capital (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601072&sid=aaA5X4B0oTyU) as the country reeled from recession, double-digit inflation and the possible collapse of the national power grid. In Honduras, a seven-month crisis (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/28/AR2009062800635.html) triggered by the attempt of a Chávez client to rupture the constitutional order quietly ended with a deal (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE60K58420100121) that will send him into exile even as a democratically elected moderate is sworn in as president.

Last but not least, a presidential election in Chile (http://www.economist.com/world/americas/displaystory.cfm?story_id=15330886), the region's most successful economy, produced the first victory by a right-wing candidate since dictator Augusto Pinochet was forced from office two decades ago. Sebastián Pińera (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/18/world/americas/18chile.html), the industrialist and champion of free markets who won, has already done something that no leader from Chile or most other Latin American nations has been willing to do in recent years: stand up to Chávez.

Venezuela is "not a democracy (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34903662/ns/world_news/)," Pińera said during his campaign. He also said, "Two great models have been shaped in Latin America: One of them led by people like Hugo Chávez in Venezuela, Castro in Cuba and Ortega in Nicaragua. . . . I definitely think the second model is best for Chile. And that's the model we are going to follow: democracy, rule of law, freedom of expression, alternation of power without caudillismo."

Pińera was only stating the obvious -- but it was more than his Socialist predecessor, Michelle Bachelet, or Brazil's Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva has been willing to say openly. That silence hamstrung the Bush and the Obama administrations, which felt, rightly or wrongly, that they should not be alone in pointing out Chávez's assault on democracy. Pińera has now provided Washington an opportunity to raise its voice about Venezuelan human rights violations. (http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/irf/2009/127408.htm)

He has done it at a moment when Chávez is already reeling from diplomatic blows. Honduras is one. Though the country is tiny, the power struggle between its established political elite and Chávez acolyte Manuel Zelaya turned into a regional battle between supporters and opponents of the Chávez left -- with Brazil and other leftist democracies straddling the middle.
The outcome is a victory for the United States, which was virtually the only country that backed the democratic election that broke the impasse. Honduras is the end of Chávez's crusade to export his revolution to other countries. Bolivia and Nicaragua will remain his only sure allies. Brazil's Lula (http://www.newsweek.com/id/215941), whose tolerance of Chávez has tarnished his bid to become a global statesman, will leave office at the end of this year; polls show his party's nominee trailing a more conservative candidate.
Haiti only deepens Chávez's hole. As the world watches, the United States is directing a massive humanitarian operation, and Haitians are literally cheering (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9m7OXtze6CA) the arrival of U.S. Marines. Chávez has no way to reconcile those images with his central propaganda message to Latin Americans, which is that the United States is an "empire" and an evil force in the region.

Then there is the meltdown Chávez faces at home. Despite the recovery in oil prices, the Venezuelan economy is deep in recession and continues to sink even as the rest of Latin America recovers. Economists guess inflation could rise to 60 percent in the coming months. Meanwhile, due to a drought, the country is threatened with the shutdown of a hydroelectric plant that supplies 70 percent of its electricity. And Chávez's failure to invest in new plants means there is no backup. There is also the crime epidemic -- homicides have tripled since Chávez took office, making Caracas one of the world's most dangerous cities. At a recent baseball game a sign in the crowd read: "3 Strikes-Lights-Water-Insecurity/President You Struck Out (http://devilsexcrement.com/2010/01/17/freedom-of-speech-not-in-venezuela-hugo-you-struck-out/)."

Chávez's thugs beat up those baseball fans. The man himself is ranting about the U.S. "occupation" of Haiti; his state television even claimed that the U.S. Navy caused the earthquake using a new secret weapon. On Sunday his government ordered cable networks to drop an opposition-minded television channel.

But Chavez's approval ratings (http://www.latinobarometro.org/) are still sinking: They've dropped to below 50 percent in Venezuela and to 34 percent in the rest of the region. The caudillo has survived a lot of bad news before and may well survive this. But the turning point in the battle between authoritarian populism and liberal democracy in Latin America has passed -- and Chávez has lost.

Keith Wilson
01-26-2010, 09:15 PM
Chavez is taking a cue from the Obama adminstration in creating distractions from the fact that his world is beginning to crash down around his ears.You're trying way too hard, Bob. Chavez would give several important body parts to have nothing worse than Obama's problems. Everything he tried to do was contingent on high oil prices; they've come back a little, but not nearly enough. I think the author of the article is too optimistic, though. Chavez has been remarkably resilient so far, he still has considerable popular support, and I think Venezuelans will unfortunately have to put up with him for another round or two.

Bob Smalser
01-26-2010, 09:54 PM
You're trying way too hard, Bob. Chavez would give several important body parts to have nothing worse than Obama's problems.

Of course you're right....what could I be thinking?

Go back to snooze mode. We'll take care of it and call you in November.

Bob Smalser
01-26-2010, 10:15 PM
You know, sometimes I wonder...
What?! Oh! I'm sorry! I'm afraid I was wondering aloud! Gentlemen please! Do continue!


Or better yet.....call us names like "Astroturf, UnAmerican, Facists" and more. And lie through your teeth spinning wins in NJ, VA and MASS as expressions of the same "anger" that brought Obama to power.

Then stand up, snivel and blubber that you were there when our kind murdered poor Harvey Milk. Even though both the murderer and those carrying those Nazi signs were Democrats and LaRouchies (also Democrats)

That'll get rid of us.

01-27-2010, 03:06 AM
Quote onzabrag: "...the management of the decline of the American Empire...."

Yes, well that's probably the nub of the matter, the GOP, if they were sensible, should be glad that it's not on their watch, yet. Such a decline can be patchy, depending on national debt levels, but sooner or later they will be in the same invidious position.
Bob, you are a genius about many things, and this is only politics. I find it disturbing to find you so bitter over what is just another passing stage in 200 years or so of sucessive governments and elections in your fortunate country.

01-27-2010, 03:43 AM
I suspect that in the end money will rear it's ugly head Cap'n, and things will go the way they always do. At least, under Obama, the US is more likely to keep it's fingers out of the pie and less likely to plot another 'revolution'. US foreign policy has always been so short term, maybe this time it will look at the long game.

01-27-2010, 07:01 AM
One thing about Venezuela: with their recently-discovered oil reserves, they have the opportunity to become the first Socialist government I can think of with the potential to provide a really great standard of living for everyone. No one else has had either the resources or the infrastructure before, much less such an in-demand resource that interfaces neatly with an existing infrastructure. I think this bears watching.

You are dreaming.

01-27-2010, 07:38 AM
Chaves, his advisors, have been listening to Art Bell et al too much. Even if we had the capacity, why would we do it to Haiti?

In order to believe in this stuff, you have to believe in a evil cabal. Men set loose from their moral foundations. While I know that happens, I'm quite sure this was a natural event, and I'm pretty sure we don't have the power to influence earthquakes.

Keith Wilson
01-27-2010, 08:05 AM
they have the opportunity to become the first Socialist government I can think of with the potential to provide a really great standard of living for everyone.Sweden.

Chavez is just another bloody-handed caudillo. Left, right, or center, they're the curse of Latin American politics.

Ian McColgin
01-27-2010, 11:02 AM
See what happens when Mark (Tylerdurden) takes a break from the Forum to advise a foreign government.

Ian McColgin
01-27-2010, 02:37 PM
I have been watching for a news sourse of record to report this story and so far I've not found one. I'd thought Chavez nutsy enough to say it, maybe, but just thinking does not make it so. Careful reading of the story raises some interesting flags and I'd like for a news service I trust to carry the story. My remark about Mark could true in more than one way.

Sometime soon we'll either have verification or another opportunity for Fox to not bother saying it's sorry.

Ian McColgin
01-27-2010, 06:15 PM
Yes, and PressTV is owned by Islamic Republic of Iran Broadcasting - a fascinating primary source for Fox to be using.

For me Fox carrying the story was a flag. IRIB-PressTV just puts credibility into a new, rather strange, dimension.