Small sailboat for kids

[Christopher Morgan]

Hello, everyone.

I am looking for a small sailboat to build so that my daughter can take command of her own vessel. I expect she will be 7 years old by the time I am finished with it. (And please don't worry, we are not out to set any youngest sailor to _____ records.)

So the idea is to find something that:

1) will sail relatively well (it is harder to learn on a boat that doesn’t sail well, I think);

2) is relatively stable (she is not at all frightened of heeling, though);

3) is easy to right from a capsize (of course, we will be right there in a “crash boat,” but the earlier she can right it herself, the better);

4) is designed for glued-lapstrake construction;

and 5) is easy on the eyes.

I thought of Joel White’s Nutshell (9’6” version) and Shellback and really like the looks of both, but never having sailed either, I don’t know how well they would satisfy the other criteria. Any other good candidates?

-- Christopher

[Thorne]

Welcome to the Forum!

More info will speed things along -- your location on this planet, waters she'll be sailing, existence of kids sailing programs or racing clubs nearby, etc.

Do you only expect her to sail this boat, or will it be rowed any sort of distance at times? Will friends, siblings or parental units be part of the crew at times?

[StevenBauer]

The Nutshell and Shellback are both great sailers. There are plans for wooden Optis, also, but the other two would be big enough for her to bring you along, too.


Steven

[David G]

My first thought was one of the Welsford boats.

Tender Behind - 7' 3":

http://www.jwboatdesigns.co.nz/plans/tenderbehind/index.htm

http://www.jwboatdesigns.co.nz/plans/tenderbehind/tenderbehind.gif

http://www.jwboatdesigns.co.nz/plans/tenderbehind/tenderbehinddraw.gif



Sherpa - 9 foot:

http://www.jwboatdesigns.co.nz/plans/sherpa/index.htm

http://www.bootbouwer.nl/welsill/sherpa-bb02.jpg

http://www.jwboatdesigns.co.nz/plans/sherpa/sherpa2.jpg



Or... my favorite for your purpose - Daniel's Boat - 10' - 6":

http://www.jwboatdesigns.co.nz/plans/danielsboat/index.htm

http://thm-a01.yimg.com/image/622db6470b69729a

http://www.jwboatdesigns.co.nz/plans/danielsboat/dblines.gif

[Christopher Morgan]

Welcome to the Forum!

More info will speed things along -- your location on this planet, waters she'll be sailing, existence of kids sailing programs or racing clubs nearby, etc.

Do you only expect her to sail this boat, or will it be rowed any sort of distance at times? Will friends, siblings or parental units be part of the crew at times?

Thanks for the welcome, Thorne.

We live in the Finger Lakes region of New York, and so most of the sailing will be done on one of these. There are kids sailing programs, but as far as I know, they only use Optis for the little ones, and I'm not that keen on building one of those.

As for the crew, I am imagining that it will be primarily her (or her and a friend), as we have a Sea Pearl for the family, and the plans for an Oughtred Arctic Tern (that's part of the motivation too: I'd like a warm-up project before tackling that beauty). That said, if it's a fun boat, who knows? As for rowing, I certainly enjoy it, but it is hard to say from here whether she will row for pleasure. If the wind dies, though, it sure would be nice if she could eventually row herself home.

[coelacanth2]

May I put in a vote for the 9'6" Nutshell? My son and I took the beginners sailing course at Woodenboat last year and got a good deal of time in one. Got more time in the 7' version this summer, the 9' is nicer. Quite quick, responsive, not the greatest to windward but FUN on a reach or run. Easy to rig. Have one going together from the kit (supplied by CLC) as we speak. Highly recommend either Shellback or Nutshell. Highly recommend the kit.

[JimConlin]

The Nutshells are good boats for many purposes. For use by a 7-year old, I'd be thinking about a shortened rig.

[DGentry]

For glued lapstrake construction, CLC's Eastport pram comes to mind . . . . http://www.clcboats.com/shop/boats/wooden-sailboat-kits/eastport-pram-rowing-sailing-kit.html

http://www.clcboats.com/scripts/phpThumb/phpThumb.php?src=/images/photos/boats/eastportpram/PRAM_on_water_25.jpg

[Christopher Morgan]

My first thought was one of the Welsford boats.



Thanks for the suggestion, David. Welsford's description of Daniel's Boat certainly makes it enticing. One initial reservation: I have the impression that his construction is typically a bit closer to S&G than I would like, even if there are strakes. Having just finished fairing in the taped joints on a S&G canoe, I think I might prefer the 'purer' forms of glued-lap. But that isn't a definite deal-breaker if there are compensating advantages to the design.

[Lewisboats]

John is a poster here so you can ask questions direct if he pops in on the thread...or connect and go off forum for more info.

[Tom3]

I have a good feeling for Joel Whites 9'6" Nutshell after seeing it raise 2 kids. I built it when they were babies and both my son and daughter spent many, many hours in the Nutshell which we use as a tender for our sailboat.

Good, stiff and stable, we never worried about capsize and often sailed with the four of us when they were younger.

No slouch either for a sailing pram as you can see as she sailed a friend (both about 9 years old then) in the Nutshell in light air years ago.
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_ASREr4k7ZNQ/Sv_tTZYXXCI/AAAAAAAAAN0/5jbKQjUWSnE/s720/Nutshell%20MJ%20Abby2.jpg

[Dave Hadfield]

My initial thought was to be concerned about a capsize in an open boat, but if you'll be handy with a crash service, I suppose it doesn't matter.

I'd also think about a reduced rig, or at the very least one that's reef-able.

In my experience, kids are quite fearless. I know I was. (And my siblings... And my own offspring...)

Sooner or later she will sneak the boat out when you're not looking, or un-reef the sail. Then dump it in a gust. (Happens!) At the very least, make sure there is lots of floatation under the seats, secured well, and that she is coached to stay with the boat no matter what.

At the risk of universal scorn and public flogging, one of the foam boat designs can allow the parent to rest easy, at least until the child is large enough to right an open wooden dinghy and bail it out. Something like a Snark can't be sunk, can be righted by a child, and it doesn't really matter if it stays full of water or not. And with the weight of a 7 year-old girl inside, sails just fine.

Same with a Sunfish with a reduced rig.

Sorry to be a wet-blanket. The important thing is to keep her alive while encouraging her to go sailing and have fun.

Dave

[Bobcat]

I learned to sail on an El Toro

[outofthenorm]

Mik Storer's PuddleDuck is pretty tough to beat for the job. Simple, safe and kid-friendly, yet sails like a "real" boat. Here's the link
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2232/1546891545_1b06bc3dc3.jpghttp://farm3.static.flickr.com/2277/1541114716_9bfa3684c2.jpg
PD racer (http://homepage.mac.com/peterhyndman/Sites/PDRinfo/)

- Norm

[Nicholas Carey]

You could do worse than an S&S Blue Jay. It even has a kid's book about a young girl fixing up an old Blue Jay (with her grandfather's help) so she can learn to sail.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/5146V0ME1ZL._SS500_.jpg (http://www.amazon.com/Sarahs-Boat-Young-Learns-Sailing/dp/0884481174)

http://www.sailbluejay.org/photos/images/bjnats07.4.jpg

http://www.sparkmanstephens.com/yachtdesign/sailyachts/805/805_enlarge.gif

It's essentially a 13 ft baby Lightning. Plans available from Sparkman & Stephens ($75) at http://www.sparkmanstephens.com/yachtdesign/sailyachts/daysailer_designs.php. You'll need to hook up with the class association, of course, at http://www.sailbluejay.org/index.html

[Hwyl]

This is an interesting thread that Carl Cramer highlighted. Chris Ostlind whose design was not used is a poter on here

http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=80164

[David G]

Everyone... please re-read the initial post.

He wants: glued lapstrake (as a warmup for building a bigger boat with that method); pleasing to the eye; stable & rightable; decent sailing performance.

As much as I love the Puddle Ducks for many applications, they're out - based on several criteria.

Blue Jay and D4/D5 are not glued lapstrake.

Etc., etc.

[Christopher Morgan]

He wants: glued lapstrake (as a warmup for building a bigger boat with that method); pleasing to the eye; stable & rightable; decent sailing performance.



Yes, David, you are right: part of my motivation here is selfish: I'm looking to build a boat for my daughter and learn about the glued lapstrake method. What's more, her design sensibilities are at an early stage, so this one can be driven by my aesthetic. This time around, I'm pretty set on a glued lap design.

That said, I've been enjoying seeing all the suggestions. Others might find them attractive. Indeed, when my daughter is old enough to become more involved in the building, one of these might be a good project for us to do together.

One thing these S&G designs have brought out is that the glued lap designs on the table so far don't have seem to have much built in buoyancy. I wonder if this is something that needs to be addressed and what the best way to do it is. Maybe adding side benches with buoyancy bags underneath?

-- Christopher

[DGentry]

The Eastport pram purportedly has floatation tanks under the fore and aft thwarts. This is a pretty easy to add feature, in most boats. Looks better than the float bags, as in an opti.

http://www.clcboats.com/scripts/phpThumb/phpThumb.php?src=/images/photos/boats/eastportpram/IMG_0271.jpg

It should be noted that CLC uses glued "lapstitch" construction, rather than true glued lapstrake. Same result, but apparently easier.

[JC 72]

Why not one of Iain's other plans, AUK or PUFFIN. It fills the order for glued lapstrake. You will get used to Iain's method, and build a beautiful and safe small boat.

[RFNK]

Why not one of Iain's other plans, AUK or PUFFIN. It fills the order for glued lapstrake. You will get used to Iain's method, and build a beautiful and safe small boat.


I'm not sure which plans JC is referring to here but I thought Iain Oughtred's plans would fit the bill too. I was thinking the Feather Pram might be a good option. You can find all Iain's designs at the Woodenboat Store website. Regards, Rick

[David G]

Rick,

I don't think that our host offers the complete catalog of Oughtred designs, but they do have a lot of them. I believe the full range can be found at this site:

http://www.jordanboats.co.uk/JB/iain_oughtred.htm

EDITED TO ADD: I also like the notion of starting with a small Oughtred boat, by way of prep for the bigger build. However, as I've said before, my sense is that double-enders tend to become a bit tiddly as you shrink the OA length down . May not be the best combo for a youngster?

[RFNK]

I don't think that our host offers the complete catalog of Oughtred designs, but they do have a lot of them. I believe the full range can be found at this site:

http://www.jordanboats.co.uk/JB/iain_oughtred.htm (http://www.jordanboats.co.uk/JB/iain_oughtred.htm)


You're right David, I should have checked, and it was in fact that Jordan Boats site where I saw the Feather dinghy. It's not a double-ender. Looks like a nice, simple little boat for a child, to me. Rick

[JC 72]

Puffin is a round bilge dinghy 10' LOA by 48" plumb transom. Lug or gunter sloop with centreboard, daggerboard or leeboard.