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Tom Hoffman
10-19-2009, 10:08 PM
Interesting.

http://action.afa.net/Blogs/BlogPost.aspx?id=2147487360

ishmael
10-19-2009, 10:41 PM
How did this loud-mouthed radio yacker gain an audience? When I've listened to him he takes some perceived grievance of the Right, the day's upset, and talks it to death in an adolescent way. I guess that's what significant portions of the Right hunger for these days, but to me he's annoying. Not that some of the issues he raises aren't worth pursuing, but he pursues them like a high school cheer leader pursues the quarterback.

"When I was a child, I spake as a child, thought as a child, but when I became a man I put away childish things."

jbelow
10-19-2009, 10:42 PM
He is very successful at being right . Where are the successful talking heads on the left?

StevenBauer
10-19-2009, 10:44 PM
Isn't he part of that crazy Mormon cult? ;)


Steven

ljb5
10-19-2009, 10:47 PM
How did this loud-mouthed radio yacker gain an audience?

It's called the Overton Window. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window)


Years ago, a goof ball like Beck would have been ridiculed anywhere in the country.

But Limbaugh got a following and then Hannity and Coulter and O'Reilly.

The window has shifted.

ljb5
10-19-2009, 10:48 PM
Where are the successful talking heads on the left?

A few years ago there was a left-wing radio talk show by a guy called "Al Franken."

He's not on the radio anymore.

He's a senator. :eek::D:eek::D:eek:

jbelow
10-19-2009, 11:00 PM
A few years ago there was a left-wing radio talk show by a guy called "Al Franken."

He's not on the radio anymore.

He's a senator. :eek::D:eek::D:eek:

Not on the radio anymore . He failed as a radio talk show host and ran as senator and won a controversial election. You sure you want to hang your hat on Al Franken? He is a funny man.

jbelow
10-19-2009, 11:05 PM
yeah, where are those talking heads? We need more disembodied heads telling us what to think.

You can turn it off , change channels , or push the ignore button. Maybe you can't because of those voices in your head.

Domesticated_Mr. Know It All
10-19-2009, 11:21 PM
Damn.
I thought this was gonna be about Jeff Beck.
It's just another political thread.
Crap.





http://davidperrystudio.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/beck7.jpg

jbelow
10-19-2009, 11:28 PM
It's called the Overton Window. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window)


Years ago, a goof ball like Beck would have been ridiculed anywhere in the country.

But Limbaugh got a following and then Hannity and Coulter and O'Reilly.

The window has shifted.

I once bought a hatch from Overton's. I did not know they sold windows.

rbgarr
10-20-2009, 02:59 AM
Not on the radio anymore . He failed as a radio talk show host and ran as senator and won a controversial election. You sure you want to hang your hat on Al Franken? He is a funny man.


Sure do. He put his money where his mouth is.

Can't say that for the 'carps'.
http://i38.tinypic.com/scvocy.jpg

John Smith
10-20-2009, 06:51 AM
A few years ago there was a left-wing radio talk show by a guy called "Al Franken."

He's not on the radio anymore.

He's a senator. :eek::D:eek::D:eek:
I loved his show. He was very determined to get his FACTS right.

The Limbaughs and Becks aren't bound by this, which allows them to be more entertaining.

Flying Orca
10-20-2009, 07:21 AM
Where are the successful talking heads on the left?

I think people on the left tend to prefer these things called "books".

Milo Christensen
10-20-2009, 08:18 AM
The White House has declared war on Fox. Three top White House officials, Emanuel, Axelrod, and Dunn all are trying to get other networks to ignore Fox. The White House is refusing requests to appear on Fox, is refusing to allow administration officials to appear on Fox. Meanwhile "Mao Zedong is my hero" Dunn is bragging about how the Obama team maintained "absolute control" over the media during the campaign. Recently, many columnists are starting to wonder why the Obama administration has remained in permanent "us vs them" mode typical of campaigns instead of "us" mode more likely to result in effective governance.

Interesting that Norman talks about "fact checking" when Dunn complained that Fox's Chris Wallace fact checked an administration official who had appeared on Fox in August.

Tom Hoffman
10-20-2009, 08:23 AM
I don't know why anyone is surprised at the Glen Beck phenomenon.

what ruin's Beck's shtick is simple inaccuracy.... it's like he doesn't even bother to fact check much of what he spouts. Then again, he doesn't need to... because he appeals to a class of listeners who really aren't all that concerned with fact-checking.

Norman, You might want to re think that statment. His facts are meticoulously checked and he invites any one, the Whitehouse included - (via the Red Hot Line, installed for their use) to correct his facts.

If you have data that disproves his facts, step up and do so, instead of taking cheap shots from the peanut gallery. He does not claim to be a news caster, he claims to be an entertainer, albiet one with a mission to wake up the sleeping giant that is most of America before the Country is stolen from us by the extreme left wing radicals.

I, Rowboat
10-20-2009, 08:33 AM
Here's to the success of the Extreme Left Wing Radicals! Hip-Hip Huzzah!

John Smith
10-20-2009, 08:48 AM
Not on the radio anymore . He failed as a radio talk show host and ran as senator and won a controversial election. You sure you want to hang your hat on Al Franken? He is a funny man.

He failed? How so?

John Smith
10-20-2009, 08:54 AM
Norman, You might want to re think that statment. His facts are meticoulously checked and he invites any one, the Whitehouse included - (via the Red Hot Line, installed for their use) to correct his facts.

If you have data that disproves his facts, step up and do so, instead of taking cheap shots from the peanut gallery. He does not claim to be a news caster, he claims to be an entertainer, albiet one with a mission to wake up the sleeping giant that is most of America before the Country is stolen from us by the extreme left wing radicals.
Actually, he's been caught lying numerous times, and admits he's not concerned with facts. This is the best I can think of, as he's lying about something there's no reason to lie about:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uHCxcHT_dk

The interesting part of this, to me, is he claims to put such a great emphasis on people needing to be honest, but he isn't.

Andrew Craig-Bennett
10-20-2009, 08:59 AM
Who pays Glenn Beck and lets him do his thing? Read up on Murdoch.



There are times when I agree with Mark.

This is one of them.

Tom Montgomery
10-20-2009, 09:04 AM
Glenn Beck is a rabble-rousing moron. Anyone who takes Beck seriously should have his head examined.

I, Rowboat
10-20-2009, 09:20 AM
There are times when I agree with Mark.

This is one of them.

Me too. It makes me feel icky all over. But you know -- a broken clock, correct twice per day, and whatnot.

Keith Wilson
10-20-2009, 09:49 AM
Originally posted by Tom Hoffman:
. . a mission to wake up the sleeping giant that is most of America before the Country is stolen from us by the extreme left wing radicals. LOL! Oh yes, "most of America" really agrees with you, despite the fact that they voted against those who agree with you in the last two national elections, and when polls consistently show that most folks disagree with the positions you support? Dream on.

I'll tell you something Mr. Eagle-for an-avatar. We, the moderate center-leftists, are indeed stealing the country from those who think like you do. We are doing this by convincing the majority of people that we have superior ideas that will make the country better. The right wing in the US today is the political persuasion of older white Christian rural and exurban men. The US is getting less and less white, less and less rural, less and less Christian, and men's relative political power has been declining for 100 years. And the vast majority of young people think you guys are nuts. Have fun with those demographic trends.

And those "extreme left wing radicals" are a pure invention of the right wing's fevered imagination. There used to be such creatures in the US around 1975. I knew some of them. There may still be a few left, but if there are any working for the Obama Administration, they've long since given up extreme left wing anything. Closing your eyes and pretending with all your might that anyone to the left of John McCain in his more moderate moments is equivalent to the Sendero Luminoso of the Khmer Rouge will not make it so. You'll look a long time in this country before you find a Trotskyite.

G.Sherman
10-20-2009, 09:51 AM
yes, Glenn Beck actually has a following.

The 3 Stooges and Hitler had the same thing.

THINK: Boneheads Boosting Their Ratings and Bank Accounts

James McMullen
10-20-2009, 09:55 AM
Here (http://crooksandliars.com/david-neiwert/militia-madness-online-game-based-am)'s a pretty disturbing online video game that features Glenn Beck front and center. Creepy!

Chris Coose
10-20-2009, 10:03 AM
Not on the radio anymore . He failed as a radio talk show host and ran as senator and won a controversial election.

Wrong. Air America failed. He worked for a long time without pay.
Al Franken is a very successful person.

I, Rowboat
10-20-2009, 11:19 AM
Wrong. Air America failed. He worked for a long time without pay.
Al Franken is a very successful person.

Failed? Then why are they still on the air? Perhaps you meant "successfully entered and then emerged from bankruptcy, and now is doing reasonably well in a number of radio markets across the country." That's what you meant, right?

I wonder if we can think of any other media outlets that operated significantly "in the red" during a prolonged startup period. Perhaps they had the good fortune to be rescued by a far-right Australian idealogue before also going bankrupt. There would be something particularly insidious about having a foreigner meddle with the political discourse of the USA, now wouldn't there?

(P.S. - not to steal anyone's thunder pre-emptively, but keep in mind that George Soros could have chosen to bail out AAR, and he is an American citizen.)

Canoez
10-20-2009, 11:26 AM
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/umedia/20091020/largeimage.7d03bed1ccd3fb55b9d12e9b2df78488.gif

:D

bobbys
10-20-2009, 12:15 PM
I love Glenn Beck I never miss him when hes on, Heck even the reruns are great as i might have missed something the first time!!

James McMullen
10-20-2009, 02:28 PM
I'm just glad that Glenn Beck doesn't try to dress up like a chick like that Coulter dude does.

Robmill0605
10-20-2009, 02:43 PM
For all of you who are so quick to dismiss Beck, the White House isn't. They have a Red Line to counter him.
It was Beck who exposed ACORN.
Beck who forced out Van Jones.
Beck who is going after Anita for her admiration of Mao.....
and more to come.
The WH sure seems worried about him.
*laughs*

Beck is the guy who claimed that Vancouver lost $1B on their Olympics... except that Vancouver's Olympics haven't even happened yet.... and you claim that he 'meticulously' checks his facts? :D

By the way Norman, you keep pointing out Beck made a simple mistake in cities. He corrected it on the air which you conveniently keep forgetting to mention .

Robmill0605
10-20-2009, 02:50 PM
Beck Strikes Again; Yosi Sergant Reassigned at NEA

By Michael A. Fletcher
The National Endowment for the Arts has reassigned former communications director Yosi Sergant, who had become the latest target of FOX News talk show host Glenn Beck.

Acting NEA communications director Victoria Hutter said Thursday that Sergant had left the communications post. The move came after he had come under attack from Beck, a conservative commentator who accused Sergant of attempting to use taxpayer money to fund art to support the president's initiatives.

Sergant's reassignment came after the resignation last weekend of environmental adviser Van Jones, who had been criticized for weeks by Beck.

The talk show host accused Sergant of arranging an August conference call with the White House Office of Public Engagement and United We Serve to recruit artists to create works in support of Obama policies. The NEA has denied that the call was inappropriate, and the White House has said that it did not force Sergant's reassignment.

ishmael
10-20-2009, 03:01 PM
"For all of you who are so quick to dismiss Beck, the White House isn't."

I don't dismiss many of his concerns, I just don't like his childish style. He's also liable to spout stuff that isn't well researched and turns out in the end to be false. Maybe I'm getting old, but frat boy hi jinx demean the debate. I didn't like them when in college, and like them less now. If that's what it takes to get our attention I say shame on us.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 03:24 PM
For all of you who are so quick to dismiss Beck, the White House isn't. They have a Red Line to counter him.
It was Beck who exposed ACORN.
Beck who forced out Van Jones.
Beck who is going after Anita for her admiration of Mao.....
and more to come.
The WH sure seems worried about him.
*laughs*

Beck is the guy who claimed that Vancouver lost $1B on their Olympics... except that Vancouver's Olympics haven't even happened yet.... and you claim that he 'meticulously' checks his facts? :D

By the way Norman, you keep pointing out Beck made a simple mistake in cities. He corrected it on the air which you conveniently keep forgetting to mention .


Great points Rob, the bottom line is that many liberals are "willingly ignorant". Amazing how they demonize the free speech of people and organizations who simply expose the truth. Who are the real radicals that threaten America; an administration with associates like Anita Dunn attempting to stifle free speech or Glenn Beck who reveals the facts about them? Can you believe someone who idolizes a mass murderer like Mao Tse-Tung is selected by the Obama administration to attack freedom of the press?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w35J_KELq6E&feature=related

ljb5
10-20-2009, 03:33 PM
It was Beck who exposed ACORN.
Beck who forced out Van Jones.
Beck who is going after Anita for her admiration of Mao.....
and more to come.

Yes, that's what he does. He targets people and engages in witch hunts.

He is hell-bent on partisan destruction and he doesn't mind bending the truth to suit his goals. The actual complaints against Anita Dunn and Van Jones were really quite pathetic.... but he just keeps hammering away until he gets what he wants.

He's the archetype of the modern conservative: Thought police reinforced by whiny complaining.

Glenn Beck called Obama a racist and said he had a deep-seated hatred of White people. This claim is not supported by facts.

And that Red Telephone? That's just pure bull****. It's just a publicity stunt. He does not and should not have an expectation that the White House will call him and make his show popular.

I've installed a Red Telephone for Jessica Alba to call me anytime she wants to get laid. Doesn't mean I have a right to expect she will or act pouty if she doesn't.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 03:37 PM
And those "extreme left wing radicals" are a pure invention of the right wing's fevered imagination. There used to be such creatures in the US around 1975. I knew some of them. There may still be a few left, but if there are any working for the Obama Administration, they've long since given up extreme left wing anything.


Would that include those who openly idolize Mao Tse-Tung?

Be honest Keith, what would you think of a Bush administration member given the job of attacking MSNBC and Keith Olbermann who gave speeches idolizing Adolf Hitler?


.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 03:42 PM
Be honest Keith, what would you think of a Bush administration member given the job of attacking MSNBC and Keith Olbermann who gave speeches idolizing Adolf Hitler?

We covered this yesterday.

John McCain quoted Mao. Bush recommended a Mao biography to Rove. Lee Atwater quoted Mao.

Barry Goldwater's campaign advisor said he followed Mao's advice.

How come you didn't flip out about that? How come you didn't even know about it?

How come Glenn Beck wasn't pounding them day after day about this????

rbgarr
10-20-2009, 03:45 PM
Would that include those who openly idolize Mao Tse-Tung?

Sure. Like Lee Atwater.

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/10/16/white-house-vs-fox-chairman-mao/

Keith Wilson
10-20-2009, 03:46 PM
Would that include those who openly idolize Mao Tse-Tung? Did you read the original quote in context? Did you read her response? If you can do both and still claim honestly with a straight face that Ms. Dunn "idolizes Mao", then you are far more out of contact with reality than I thought.

Consider Sun Tzu, whom I do not "idolize", just to be perfectly clear :rolleyes: , but who knew a few things. If you think the Obama administration consists of "extreme left-wing radicals", you do not know your enemy. You are not even trying to know your enemy; you are just making yourself feel righteous. But be my guest.
It is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you will not be imperiled in a hundred battles; if you do not know your enemies but do know yourself, you will win one and lose one; if you do not know your enemies nor yourself, you will be imperiled in every single battle.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 03:51 PM
Yes, that's what he does. He targets people and engages in witch hunts.

That seems to be a very poor choice of wording. Can we assume that term describes an attempt to falsely accuse? It would seem if a woman puts on a black dress with a pointy hat and gives speeches touting her favorite spells that stating she appears to be a witch does not qualify as a "witch hunt".


He's the archetype of the modern conservative: Thought police reinforced by whiny complaining.


You've got it completely backwards. It's the left wingers who are the PC, "hate crime", "fairness doctrine" thought police!

.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 03:58 PM
That seems to be a very poor choice of wording. Can we assume that term describes an attempt to falsely accuse? It would seem if a woman puts on a black dress with a pointy hat and gives speeches touting her favorite spells that pointing out she is a witch does not qualify as a "witch hunt".

To Glenn Beck, everything looks like a black dress with a point hat.... even if it's just a green dress with a pill box hat.


You've got it completely backwards. It's the left wingers who are the PC, "hate crime", "fairness doctrine" thought police!

Yes, I understand that is your talking point, but it's not reflected by reality.

There's Glen Beck... on TV, criticizing people for speaking their minds and expressing their opinions and even for signing a petition.

What laws have they broken? What is the justification for the attack?

Beck's problem isn't so much that he's loose with the facts (he hardly uses any at all). His main problem is that he's too firm with the opinions.

When Michelle Obama made some comments about how she felt about growing up in America, Beck went absolutely ape****.

Why? Well Ms. Obama's experiences and opinions were different than Beck's. Beck went on and on about how he felt about America.... and said it was wrong of Michelle to feel differently.

What right does he have to tell her how she ought to feel??

Why can't he see that she has her own experiences and her own reasons and she has a right to feel the way she does and express her opinions?

Why does he think she is wrong to feel differently than he does?

Beck wants to be the thought police. He attacks other people for seeing things differently than he does.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 04:01 PM
We covered this yesterday.

Sorry I missed it.....


John McCain quoted Mao. Bush recommended a Mao biography to Rove. Lee Atwater quoted Mao.

I don't recall any of the above giving speeches idolizing Mao. In spite of that, I have problems with all four named above anyway and in it's own way wouldn't surprise me if it were true.


How come Glenn Beck wasn't pounding them day after day about this????

If you were paying attention you would know Glenn Beck has strongly criticized W and John McCain.

Keith Wilson
10-20-2009, 04:04 PM
I don't recall any of the above giving speeches idolizing Mao.I don't recall anyone mentioned in this thread giving a speech idolizing Mao.

Know your enemies.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 04:06 PM
I don't recall any of the above giving speeches idolizing Mao.

Nothing could surprise me less than discovering your ignorance of the subject.

You still don't have the Dunn quote (or context) quite right.

As Anita Dunn said, 'I also mentioned Mother Teresa, but no one is accusing me of being a saint.'

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 04:15 PM
Yes... but accusing a woman of 'idolizing Mao' because she made a passing reference to Mao, in a totally unrelated context, in a single speech, DOES qualifies as a 'witch hunt'.


Passing reference???:confused:

Did you listen to the speech Norman? She went on and on about how Mao was one of the two people in the entire world she admired most! That's not a passing reference!!!

Since Keith refused to be intellectually honest and answer the question, I will turn it over to you:

What would you think about a member of the Bush administration put charge of attacking MSNBC and Keith Olbermann, if a few months prior had given a speech exclaiming that Adolf Hitler was one of the two people they admired most?

.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 04:22 PM
Did you listen to the speech Norman?

I did.


She went on and on about how Mao was one of the two people in the entire world she admired most!

"On and on"?? You're over-reaching your argument.

You're exaggerating.

That's okay. We expected you would do this. It's a fairly common reaction when people get trapped.

Keith Wilson
10-20-2009, 04:28 PM
Beck edited her remarks and left out half of the sentence. This is the part of the sentence Beck quoted:
The third lesson and tip actually comes from two of my favorite political philosophers: Mao Tse-tung and Mother Theresa -- not often coupled with each other, but the two people I turn to most . . . The fellow is willfully distorting the truth to make a political point. And in this sentence, so are you.
She went on and on about how Mao was one of the two people in the entire world she admired most! That's not a passing reference!!! She did not say Mao was one of the people she admired most, and she did not go "on and on"; she made an ironic reference to him at which the audience laughed; they got the irony, even if you didn't.

You aren't trying to understand those with whom you disagree. If you honestly think that Ms. Dunn is actually a closet Maoist, you are working with a false view of the world, and weakening yourself and your cause. Your call.

John Smith
10-20-2009, 04:34 PM
Failed? Then why are they still on the air? Perhaps you meant "successfully entered and then emerged from bankruptcy, and now is doing reasonably well in a number of radio markets across the country." That's what you meant, right?

I wonder if we can think of any other media outlets that operated significantly "in the red" during a prolonged startup period. Perhaps they had the good fortune to be rescued by a far-right Australian idealogue before also going bankrupt. There would be something particularly insidious about having a foreigner meddle with the political discourse of the USA, now wouldn't there?

(P.S. - not to steal anyone's thunder pre-emptively, but keep in mind that George Soros could have chosen to bail out AAR, and he is an American citizen.)
Just to keep this in perspective, failing or succeeding is not a measurement of being wrong or being right.

John Smith
10-20-2009, 04:39 PM
Great points Rob, the bottom line is that many liberals are "willingly ignorant". Amazing how they demonize the free speech of people and organizations who simply expose the truth. Who are the real radicals that threaten America; an administration with associates like Anita Dunn attempting to stifle free speech or Glenn Beck who reveals the facts about them? Can you believe someone who idolizes a mass murderer like Mao Tse-Tung is selected by the Obama administration to attack freedom of the press?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w35J_KELq6E&feature=related

I don't think you fully undestand what we see as a problem. Beck fequently gets his facts wrong. He ADMITS he's not a reporter and doesn't check his facts. Franken wrote a whole book, DOCUMENTING Limbaugh's facts that weren't true, and got a response from Limbaugh that he, Limbaugh, is an entertainer and doesn't need to have his facts right.

You can only base a premise on a false fact if the premise is pre-believed. If you have to make up facts to support the premise, the premise is no good.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 04:39 PM
Nothing could surprise me less than discovering your ignorance of the subject.

You still don't have the Dunn quote (or context) quite right.

As Anita Dunn said, 'I also mentioned Mother Teresa, but no one is accusing me of being a saint.'

I included a link to a video recording of Glenn Beck and her speech. It speaks the truth entirely for itself.....

Furthermore Ms "link to think", put up the public speeches from the people you named and let's see where they openly promote the philosophy of Mao or some other anti-freedom, mass murderer. Unlike LWers such as yourself who tow the liberal line under any circumstance, some of us are true to philosophy and are quick to oppose RINOs and phony conservatives. I can't stand freaking McCain, did not vote for him and it wouldn't surprise me if something he said like that was true. However, like so many other subjects, you knew absolutely nothing about any connection with Mao and the people you named until google or some other LW internet sources handed you a counterpoint to defend another highly suspect Obama associate attacking free speech.

.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 04:44 PM
... another highly suspect Obama associate attacking free speech.

Your argument is shifting again.

When she was talking about Mother Teresa and Mao, she was talking about the importance of finding your own path in life.

She didn't say anything that could be considered "attacking free speech."

You're getting really flexible with the facts again.

The only person attacking free speech is Glenn Beck who tries to get people fired for expressing their opinions or signing petitions. He's the thought police.

John Smith
10-20-2009, 04:46 PM
Yes, that's what he does. He targets people and engages in witch hunts.

He is hell-bent on partisan destruction and he doesn't mind bending the truth to suit his goals. The actual complaints against Anita Dunn and Van Jones were really quite pathetic.... but he just keeps hammering away until he gets what he wants.

He's the archetype of the modern conservative: Thought police reinforced by whiny complaining.

Glenn Beck called Obama a racist and said he had a deep-seated hatred of White people. This claim is not supported by facts.

And that Red Telephone? That's just pure bull****. It's just a publicity stunt. He does not and should not have an expectation that the White House will call him and make his show popular.

I've installed a Red Telephone for Jessica Alba to call me anytime she wants to get laid. Doesn't mean I have a right to expect she will or act pouty if she doesn't.

Yes, he drove the anti-ACORN campaign. Doubt he supported this legislation, however.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/#33185572

Keith Wilson
10-20-2009, 04:47 PM
a video recording of Glenn Beck and her speech. It speaks the truth entirely for itself.....A truncated quote, changing the meaning of what she said. Read the whole thing.

But again, if you honestly think that Ms. Dunn is a closet Maoist, you are working with a false view of the world. This weakens yourself and your cause. That's fine with me.

John Smith
10-20-2009, 04:49 PM
Would that include those who openly idolize Mao Tse-Tung?

Be honest Keith, what would you think of a Bush administration member given the job of attacking MSNBC and Keith Olbermann who gave speeches idolizing Adolf Hitler?


.
I'd have to be shown where the "idolizing' comes in. One can look at Hitler, and use him as a teaching tool, without idolizing him. He can be held up as an example, without liking what he did.

Is there an honest link here (if I missed it, I'm sorry; point me to it, please) that makes "idolizing" the proper term?

ishmael
10-20-2009, 05:16 PM
"I don't recall anyone mentioned in this thread giving a speech idolizing Mao."

Ms. Dunn, saying to a group of school children, that he was one of her two top political theorists, comes damn close to idolizing. She said it, and should be called on it, along with Obama for appointing her. She should be fired, and Obama's feet held to the fire.

Imagine if anyone said "Adolf Hitler is one of my greatest political influences." Mao, because of the distance in cultures, doesn't ring the bell the same way, but he was as evil as Hitler, murdered millions of his countrymen, both directly and through "The Cultural Revolution."

How good people on the Left continue to defend this is a mystery. Some sort of ideological blinders.

Tom Montgomery
10-20-2009, 05:44 PM
Does Glenn still claim to hate the 9/11 families?

Beck has a reputation here in Louisville as an a-hole. He was an extremely rude, obnoxious and tiresome "morning zoo" radio moron here. And he was also a very public drug addict.

He is cashing in now. I am just gob-smacked that there appear to be Forumites here who buy his act. Evidently the 28% love his dog-and-pony show.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 05:57 PM
At this point, as an alternative to giving in to the temptation to accuse you of having an incredibly limited comprehension of the English language, it might be better just to reproduce the portion of Dunn's speech, in which she used Mao and Mother Theresa as metaphors for self-determination. You DO know what a metaphor is, don't you?

Norman, it would appear that only a pseudo intellectual would to fail to connect the dots in the context of what is being pointed out about the general philosophy of Ms Dunn. (I will assume that term doesn't have to be explained)

Let me take this a step further using Ms Dunn's words that you quoted and adding some from another occasion so that the forest might come into a little more in focus through the trees.



[I]

[I]In 1947, when Mao Tse-tung was being challenged within his own party, on his plan to basically take China over, Chiang Kai-shek and the nationalist Chinese held the cities, they had the army, they had the air force, they had everything on their side and people said how can you win, how can you do this, how can you do this against all odds against you, and Mao Tse-tung said “You fight your war and I’ll fight mine.” Think about that for a second, you don’t have to accept the definition of how to do things and you don’t have to follow other people’s choices in the past.



Does this mean she does not need to respect the ways things traditionally have been done in America according to the constitution in respect of individual liberty? A genuine man of intellect should be able to see something extremely poignant in those words from Anita Dunn in the context of this discussion. Especially when considering some of the other statements she has made which are much more in line with someone like Mao than with the principles of freedom in America.

As Anita Dunn said to Dominican government officials about the way communication was handled through the Obama campaign:

"Very rarely did we communicate through the press anything that we didn't absolutely control"


Start putting the pieces of the puzzle together and a thinking man should be able to understand why some have a problem with people like Ms Dunn who proclaim Mao as influential in her life while boasting at another occasion about controlling communication through the press!

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 06:00 PM
"I don't recall anyone mentioned in this thread giving a speech idolizing Mao."

Ms. Dunn, saying to a group of school children, that he was one of her two top political theorists, comes damn close to idolizing. She said it, and should be called on it, along with Obama for appointing her. She should be fired, and Obama's feet held to the fire.

Imagine if anyone said "Adolf Hitler is one of my greatest political influences." Mao, because of the distance in cultures, doesn't ring the bell the same way, but he was as evil as Hitler, murdered millions of his countrymen, both directly and through "The Cultural Revolution."

How good people on the Left continue to defend this is a mystery. Some sort of ideological blinders.


That is exactly what it is Ismael, ideological blinders......



.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 06:20 PM
Let me take this a step further using Ms Dunn's words that you quoted and adding some from another occasion so that the forest might come into a little more in focus through the trees.

Dude, that's some serious tin-foil hat conspiracy ****.

She was a communications director. The job of a communications director is to release information to the press.

Every single campaign has one and they all try to do the same job in the same way.

It is not subversive, it is not unconstitutional, illegal, anti-American or immoral in anyway.

Of course she tried to control the message. Just like McCain tried (rather pathetically), and Bush and Rove and every other candidate in the history of the universe.

You're really, really stretching your argument now.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 06:23 PM
...Ms. Dunn, saying to a group of school children, that he was one of her two top political theorists, comes damn close to idolizing.....

Oh, so now it's just "damn close."

And the back-pedaling begins. :D

Remember when Bush said, "There ought to be limits to freedom."

Was he quoting Mao, or Stalin or Hitler..... or was that his own political philosophy?

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 06:33 PM
There's Glen Beck... on TV, criticizing people for speaking their minds and expressing their opinions

Why not? Isn't it perfectly withing his rights to expose people in positions of power for what they say and believe?



What laws have they broken? What is the justification for the attack?

Does a law have to be broken to play video of someones speech? Obviously people like you don't have a problem with someone who aligns themselves with Mao, but a lot of other people do.


When Michelle Obama made some comments about how she felt about growing up in America, Beck went absolutely ape****.

Why?

Pretty simple, most people are proud of America long before that stage in Michelle's life.


What right does he have to tell her how she ought to feel??

GB didn't say how she should feel and you along with every other viewer are completely free to decide what to think about it. An example of real thought control is the left wing "fairness doctrine".


Why can't he see that she has her own experiences and her own reasons and she has a right to feel the way she does and express her opinions?

I'm sure she does have her own reasons for being proud of America for the first time that late in life. She has the right to feel that way and express it.



Beck wants to be the thought police. He attacks other people for seeing things differently than he does.

No, once again you completely failed to make a case. GB has every right to point out what people openly state. If a person doesn't like someone quoting them admiring Mao or saying in their 40's that they are proud of America for the first time in their lives they should just be more careful what they reveal about themselves to the public. It's not the messengers fault if their own words come back to haunt them.....

.

John Smith
10-20-2009, 06:40 PM
Why not? Isn't it perfectly withing his rights to expose people in positions of power for what they say and believe?




Does a law have to be broken to play video of someones speech? Obviously people like you don't have a problem with someone who aligns themselves with Mao, but a lot of other people do.



Pretty simple, most people are proud of America long before that stage in Michelle's life.



GB didn't say how she should feel and you along with every other viewer are completely free to decide what to think about it. An example of real thought control is the left wing "fairness doctrine".



I'm sure she does have her own reasons for being proud of America for the first time that late in life. She has the right to feel that way and express it.




No, once again you completely failed to make a case. GB has every right to point out what people openly state. If a person doesn't like someone quoting them admiring Mao or saying in their 40's that they are proud of America for the first time in their lives they should just be more careful what they reveal about themselves to the public. It's not the messengers fault if their own words come back to haunt them.....

.
Who's denying Beck his right to speak his opinion? That is different, however, than telling false things as facts on a "news" network.

Please explain how admiring someone's "out of the box" thinking on how to wage a war, is construed as anything past that.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 06:41 PM
Obviously people like you don't have a problem with someone who aligns themselves with Mao...

Aligns herself with Mao?

You're over-reaching again. She quoted Mao (and Mother Teresa). She didn't join his army.

There is a huge difference between looking at his approach to solving a problem vs. "aligning" herself with him.

Try not to let your stupid get out in front of you like that.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 06:53 PM
Try not to let your stupid get out in front of you like that.

You are the clueless one jib5 and prove it once again by ignoring genuine examples of LW attempted thought control on one hand while miserably failing to tie the concept to Glenn Beck with the other. The examples of free speech you gave as an illustration of mind control were beyond pathetic. Better stick to topics where you can totally "link to think".


.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 06:54 PM
Who's denying Beck his right to speak his opinion?

Better ask ljb5, she seems to be the one who has the problem with it.



.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 07:01 PM
Rick-Mi,

Would you like to revise your statement that she "aligned herself with Mao"?

Both you and Mr. Beck have shown us that you cannot discuss this topic without exaggeration, distortion and deception.

Use of words like "idolize" and "aligns" are not supported by reality. Beck even went so far as to clip her quote in mid-sentence to change the meaning.

If you have to lie this much, you're probably not on the winning path.

Let me ask this question straight-out:


Do you really believe she "idolizes" Mao and "aligns herself" with Mao.... or do you just find that a convenient point of attack?

I suspect that, deep down, you know you're exaggerating. But you feel like you caught her and you want to hit her a few times.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 07:38 PM
Rick-Mi,

Would you like to revise your statement that she "aligned herself with Mao"?


Let me ask this question straight-out:


Do you really believe she "idolizes" Mao and "aligns herself" with Mao.... or do you just find that a convenient point of attack?




Chariman Mao was listed by name along with one other person by Ms Dunn in the following ways:

one of her "favorite political philosophers"

and "two of the people I turn to the most"

I cannot fathom the type of Whitehouse cabinet member who has a communist representing one of the greatest mass murderers of all time as their "favorite political philosopher". Sorry if a number of far left liberals ignore what this man stands for and has done, but a lot of Americans don't think someone who views Chairman Mao as one of "the two people I turn to the most" should represent the President of the United States in the land of the free. It's a very negative reflection on the presidency and Ms Dunn is not alone......

ljb5
10-20-2009, 07:43 PM
and "two of the people I turn to the most"


You're still using that quote clipped in mid-sentence. That subtle distortion and deception makes you appear dishonest.

I'm asking if you really believe she idolizes him.

Keep in mind --- she picked up the Mao quote from Lee Atwater.

So do you really believe it, or are you just trying to get your licks in while you have a convenient target?

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 07:44 PM
has it been covered that McCain quoted Mao? Obviously the socialist, muslim,fascist, communist menace is deeper than we thought!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYJ15vbo15w

Even in the context in which he was mentioned, I don't think John McCain had any business quoting Chairman Mao. Add that to the long list of reasons I couldn't force myself to vote for him in spite of knowing who was on the other end of the ballot.



.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 07:51 PM
Even in the context in which he was mentioned, I don't think John McCain had any business quoting Chairman Mao. Add that to the long list of reasons I couldn't force myself to vote for him in spite of knowing who was on the other end of the ballot.

So, basically you're just saying that no one can ever mention Mao under and circumstances?

Gee, I dunno what to tell you. Bush and Rove, Atwater and Dunn, McCain and Goldwater....

You're facing quite a tide. I predict you're going to be lonely and unhappy.

Still, you haven't answered my question: Do you really believe she idolizes Mao, or are you just drumming up a fight?

ljb5
10-20-2009, 07:55 PM
who is it ok to quote?

His signature is a Jefferson quotation. (Sort of. It's a misquote of his letter to Thomas Cooper).

Jefferson owned slaves.

Apparently Rick-Mi idolizes slave owners.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 07:55 PM
You're still using that quote clipped in mid-sentence. That subtle distortion and deception makes you appear dishonest.


You are dead wrong again ljb5! Listen to the section of her speech for yourself this time without anyone else telling you what she said. The exact comment I quoted stating "two of the people I turn to the most" is about the 35 second mark.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xYL6Nvl3jI

If a Bush cabinet member said Hitler was one of "two of the people I turn to the most" you people would be going ape****. I can't believe how intellectually dishonest liberals can be. :rolleyes:


.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 07:59 PM
You are dead wrong again ljb5! Listen to the section of her speech for yourself this time without anyone else telling you what she said. The exact comment I quoted stating "two of the people I turn to the most" is about the 35 second mark.

Yes... that's what she says at 35 seconds.

But the sentence does not end there. Do not clip the quote in mid sentence.

That is dishonest. This has been pointed out to you more than once already.

I'm beginning to think you're dumb in addition to dishonest.

ishmael
10-20-2009, 08:08 PM
You Leftist, useful, idiots can't seem to get it through your skulls that there's a difference between quoting someone, and calling them your political mentor.

"I go the way that Providence dictates with the assurance of a sleepwalker."

Adolf Hitler

ljb5
10-20-2009, 08:09 PM
You Leftist, useful, idiots can't seem to get it through your skulls that there's a difference between quoting someone, and calling them your political mentor.

Who called who their "political mentor"???

Now you're just making stuff up.

If you can't stick to the facts, you don't get to make up your own.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 08:14 PM
Yes... that's what she says at 35 seconds.

But the sentence does not end there.

Do not clip the quote in mid sentence.

That is dishonest.

Nonsense, the quote doesn't have to continue to completely understand what she said. Furthermore, what was stated immediatly after about "choices" "challenge" and "why not" fits right in with the problem many freedom loving Americans have with someone in a position of power who names one of the greatest mass murderers of all time as one of the people they turn to the most. You see the choices Mao assumed in his challenges resulted in starvation, torture and the murder of millions of people. Why not?

While we are on the subject of Eastern philosophers, you might want to brush up on Sun Tzu and learn to pick your battles. :D



.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 08:18 PM
You Leftist, useful, idiots can't seem to get it through your skulls that there's a difference between quoting someone, and calling them your political mentor.

"I go the way that Providence dictates with the assurance of a sleepwalker."

Adolf Hitler


Wait Ishmael (the useful idiots will say), she didn't say "mentor" she said "favorite political philosophers" and "two of the people I turn to the most". Now get your facts straight! LOL


.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 08:18 PM
Nonsense, the quote doesn't have to continue to completely understand what she said.

You're still being dishonest.

Listen to the quote again.


... the two people I turn to most to basically deliver a simple point ...


...to basically deliver a simple point.

Not "to guide my political philosophy."

Not "to shape my world view."

Not "to give purpose to my life."

Not "to inspire me."

"to basically deliver a simple point."

Tom Montgomery
10-20-2009, 08:22 PM
Ninety-five posts on a thread about Glenn Beck.

Color me: stunned. :confused:

I mean, in all seriousness, a Christian is not required to accept self-promoting frauds like Earnest Angeley or Benny Hinn. What is with the right-wing fascination with Glenn Beck?

The people here in Louisville who know him personally consider him to be a complete fraud who is milking his right-wing true-believing audience for the cash.

If you don't get it, watch the flick Elmer Gantry and get back to me.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 08:22 PM
;) Keep trying.....

pefjr
10-20-2009, 08:24 PM
I can't believe how intellectually dishonest liberals can be. :rolleyes:

Don't the libs have to be an intellectual first?:D

pefjr
10-20-2009, 08:26 PM
Ninety-five posts on a thread about Glenn Beck.

Color me: stunned. :confused:Glenn Beck must be proud to have a thread all to his own on WB.:D

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 08:33 PM
Ninety-five posts on a thread about Glenn Beck.

Color me: stunned. :confused:


Glenn Beck is an interesting commentator. When I'm on the road before noon I alternate radio buttons between him and Dennis Miller with no particular preference trying to avoid commercials. What I hear from him is fairly decent and definitely pro-American.

I rarely get to see his television program because I'm rarely home by the time it's over. When able to catch it, his show isn't bad. Certainly not something I set on the DVR, but you guys have me thinking about possibly recording some shows to keep track of what all the fuss from the LW and Whitehouse is about.

Like anything you see on television, it's best to stay a bit skeptical and keep an open mind.


.

James McMullen
10-20-2009, 08:52 PM
Rick-Mi, I just got caught up on this thread and I have to say I'm truly embarrassed for you. . .or by you. . .or whatever. You seem determined to continue to believe whatever it is you believe despite enormous heaps of contrasting evidence. As Keith pointed out, by failing to even try to understand the actual views of your political opponents, you don't weaken them, and you really, really don't strengthen yourself. You can't possibly be intellectually content with your cartoon caricature version of that lady, can you? I think you should start over back at the beginnning and re-read this thread just as I did--you just may well pick up on the fact that you've been floundering badly for the last however-many-it-was posts.

Here's something you just said:

. . .it's best to stay a bit skeptical and keep an open mind.
Practice what you preach, amigo. Your performance tonight so far has hardly lived up to that.

Tom Montgomery
10-20-2009, 08:59 PM
Glenn Beck is an interesting commentator. When I'm on the road before noon I alternate radio buttons between him and Dennis Miller with no particular preference trying to avoid commercials. What I hear from him is fairly decent and definitely pro-American.

I rarely get to see his television program because I'm rarely home by the time it's over. When able to catch it, his show isn't bad. Certainly not something I set on the DVR, but you guys have me thinking about possibly recording some shows to keep track of what all the fuss from the LW and Whitehouse is about.

Like anything you see on television, it's best to stay a bit skeptical and keep an open mind.

I am simply here to tell you that Glenn Beck is a complete and utter fraud, from top to bottom. The people here who know him personally tell me that he has cynically hit upon a formula that fattens his bank account.

But, hey, if his rants make you feel better... He is happy and you are happy.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 09:24 PM
Rick-Mi, I just got caught up on this thread and I have to say I'm truly embarrassed for you. . .or by you. . .or whatever.

James, coming from you I'll take that as a compliment. That's the reason I like to come here from time to time, it's entertaining in a perverse sort of way witnessing just how ignorant liberals are when it comes to the principles that uphold freedom and how intellectually dishonest the far left can be with themselves and others. I'm sorry to be so blunt, but the term "useful idiots" certainly applies. I don't say this lightly, you are a dangerous bunch when it comes to the future of freedom and liberty in America.


.

Rick-Mi
10-20-2009, 09:33 PM
I am simply here to tell you that Glenn Beck is a complete and utter fraud, from top to bottom. The people here who know him personally tell me that he has cynically hit upon a formula that fattens his bank account.

But, hey, if his rants make you feel better... He is happy and you are happy.

Tom, perhaps there is some sort of misunderstanding, but I don't recall giving him anything approaching a carte blanche endorsement. In fact, quite a few on the far right have some serious problems with Glenn Beck too (including Mark on this forum). If you would listen to him yourself I'm quite sure you would come away with the feeling he has America's best interest at heart. What the heck is wrong with fiscal responsibility, the family unit and family values? To be honest, if he is a fraud putting on a show it would be a great disappointment. The guy is pretty darn open about failures in his past and how he has overcome them. Perhaps time will tell, but right now that is pretty difficult to determine that he is a fraud. Keep in mind success creates a lot of jealousy and there will always be people who badmouth those like GB who have made it to the top.

RodB
10-20-2009, 09:49 PM
James, coming from you I'll take that as a compliment. That's the reason I like to come here from time to time, it's entertaining in a perverse sort of way witnessing just how ignorant liberals are when it comes to the principles that uphold freedom and how intellectually dishonest the far left can be with themselves and others. I'm sorry to be so blunt, but the term "useful idiots" certainly applies. I don't say this lightly, you are a dangerous bunch when it comes to the future of freedom and liberty in America.

Talk about hitting the nail on the head...

FYI... Beck once said he hated the two party system in our country because all it did was polarize the country and cause people to be on one side or another rather than just focus on whats best for America. He makes a lot of sense if you take time to listen, despite his theatrical shenanigans at times.

RodB

Tom Montgomery
10-20-2009, 10:02 PM
If you would listen to him yourself I'm quite sure you would come away with the feeling he has America's best interest at heart.
I do keep in touch with Beck on Fox News. My feeling is that he has his own interests at heart.

What the heck is wrong with fiscal responsibility, the family unit and family values?
Not a thing. But those issues are not at the top of Beck's agenda. If only they were.

To be honest, if he is a fraud putting on a show it would be a great disappointment. The guy is pretty darn open about failures in his past and how he has overcome them. Perhaps time will tell, but right now that is pretty difficult to determine that he is a fraud. Keep in mind success creates a lot of jealousy and there will always be*
*people who badmouth those lik GB who have made it to the top.
Honest and open like Rush Limbaugh? Or Shepard Smith? Or David Dreier? Or Charlie Crist? Or Ed Schrock? Or Ed Koch? Or James McGreevey? Or Jim McCrery? Or Larry Craig? Or Mitch McConnell?

Pardon my open cynicism.

pefjr
10-20-2009, 10:08 PM
[quote=Rick-Mi;2357839]If you would listen to him yourself I'm quite sure you would come away with the feeling he has America's best interest at heart. quote]
I checked him out and came away with a strong felling he has Glenn Beck's best interest at heart. He DOES NOT have America's interest any where near his heart. He is a bigot and he knows how to make a buck off the hate and fear he generates. Some, including myself, have boycotted his advertisers and will continue to do so. We will see how much longer he lasts. People like him usually will hang themselves sooner or later.:)

RodB
10-20-2009, 10:09 PM
Honest and open like Rush Limbaugh? Or Shepard Smith? Or David Dreier? Or Charlie Crist? Or Ed Schrock? Or Ed Koch? Or James McGreevey? Or Jim McCrery? Or Larry Craig? Or Mitch McConnell?

Ok, this is a test... I don't think you libs like anyone who is an outspoken conservative....and you always accuse them of lying...

So What did you guys think of Tony Snow, a man who,s integrity was unquestioned in Washington? Did he lie with every breath???

Just wondered?

R

Keith Wilson
10-20-2009, 10:15 PM
I don't think you libs like anyone who is an outspoken conservative.Nah. I liked William F. Buckley - respected him, certainly, although I rarely agreed with him (almost never, to be honest). I like George Will, although sometimes he goes of the deep end. David Brooks is more moderate, but he's very good. I don't know anything about Tony Snow. (Obviously I'm more a written-word kind of guy.)

RodB
10-20-2009, 10:18 PM
Didn't you see him on Fox or as the press secretary for Bush?

Extremely sharp guy with a great reputation.

I once met Wm F Buckley, and found him to be very down to earth... we talked sailing for a few minutes until the magazine writer told me to take my photos and say goodbye.

RodB

Keith Wilson
10-20-2009, 10:22 PM
Didn't you see him on Fox or as the press secretary for BushSorry, I don't watch TV.

Tom Montgomery
10-20-2009, 10:25 PM
I had no problem with Tony Snow or William F. Buckley or Barry Goldwater.

On the other hand, I think Ari Fleisher and Dana Perino were liars. Scott McClellan was not.

I once subscribed to the New Republic. :eek:

I have no problem with either George Will, David Brooks, or Charles Krauthammer. There are others I could name who hold opinions with which I disagree but who I respect.

The Fox News and Clear Channel Communications crews are despicable.

The problem began with Saint Ronaldus Maximus. And I say that having voted for the man.

ljb5
10-20-2009, 10:27 PM
Nonsense, the quote doesn't have to continue to completely understand what she said.

So, Rick.... now that you've had a chance to listen to her full quote (and not just the abbreviated portion you posted), I ask you again.

Do you really believe she idolizes Mao?

Do you really believe she is "aligned" with Mao....

Or do you think maybe she was just using a quote to illustrate a point?

Memphis Mike
10-20-2009, 10:35 PM
Beck is a Nazis. His followers are Nazis.

RodB
10-20-2009, 10:35 PM
The Fox News and Clear Channel Communications crews are despicable.

As many here, I have seen news stories reported on Fox in addition to most other news organizations. I have found their straight news to be balanced.

There was a study done by an organization focused on truth in reporting which found Fox to be the most balanced of all news sources during the last campaign. Fox was found to have about 50:50 coverage in negative and positive news stories about Obama and McCain across the board... MSNBC was like 75% negative towards the Repubs...

RodB

Memphis Mike
10-20-2009, 10:39 PM
Not too smart Nazis at that. His following is the bottom of the barrel.

Tom Montgomery
10-20-2009, 10:42 PM
I expect all good conservative Forumites to studiously avoid responding to post #109. A pity.

ishmael
10-20-2009, 10:43 PM
"So, Rick.... now that you've had a chance to listen to her full quote (and not just the abbreviated portion you posted), I ask you again.

Do you really believe she idolizes Mao?

Do you really believe she is "aligned" with Mao....

Or do you think maybe she was just using a quote to illustrate a point?"

She did say that Mao was one of her top two political philosophers. You'd think, as a communications director for the White House, if that isn't what she meant she wouldn't have said it. Communications director? What the hell is that post anyway? When was it ensconced in the pantheon of White House aids? Most of those people seem like cotton wool between the president and his constituents. I want more direct access. Let most of those people go find a real job and give us back a real president, not some image cooked up by media advisors.

If wishes were horses.

Chris Coose
10-20-2009, 10:44 PM
I don't say this lightly, you are a dangerous bunch when it comes to the future of freedom and liberty in America.




And you can pound sand while you are blathering heavy.

RodB
10-20-2009, 11:25 PM
Beck is a Nazis. His followers are Nazis.

The most Nazis-like folks are those in the present administration that want to totally rule the country with no concern for what the people may want.. . and of course M MIke.

R

ljb5
10-20-2009, 11:46 PM
She did say that Mao was one of her top two political philosophers.

Yup.... right up there with Mother Teresa. Neither Mao nor Mother Teresa were political philosophers.

Did you notice the audience laugh when she said that?

They got the irony. It's a pity you didn't.

It's a humorous device known as "juxtaposition."

Besides... you still haven't answered the question of if you really think she idolizes Mao. You just keep saying that she made a comment. But do you really believe that means she worships Mao???

ishmael
10-20-2009, 11:56 PM
So, you're saying Lj that her comment was tongue in cheek?

As to watching either her or the audience, I'm on dial up and my TV is dead.

From what I can gather, if her comment was in jest she didn't carry it off well.

ljb5
10-21-2009, 12:15 AM
So, you're saying Lj that her comment was tongue in cheek?

Yup.


From what I can gather, if her comment was in jest she didn't carry it off well.

I saw the video. The audience chuckled. She carried it off just fine.

The part where she juxtaposed Mao with Mother Teresa should have given you a hint.

Have you ever noticed Mao and Mother Teresa don't really go together? Kinda funny to see their names side-by-side, ain't it???

She even said, "...Mao Tse-tung and Mother Theresa -- not often coupled with each other..."

And then the audience chuckled.

Pretty much everyone got it except for Glenn Beck. But that's mostly because he's on a witch hunt.... so he would have accused her of anything.

And of course, he has his audience who are self-selected for stupidity.

She never said Mao was her "hero" (Beck lied about that.) She never said she followed him, or idolized him or was aligned with him.

The only thing she said is that she uses him to make a simple point about finding your own path.

Are we done here?

perldog007
10-21-2009, 12:55 AM
I can't know what is in Anita Dunn's heart and mind. I can't help what it means to me when I saw her speech to those High School students.

When I was in High School, I would have thought that was cool. If you're not a socialist by age twenty, you have no heart. If you're still a socialist at age thirty, you have no head. ( wish I could remember who I stole that gem from)

High School was a few decades back for me. I no longer think it's cool. My bad? If you say so, whatever gets you through the night.

We did have an election. Democrats did win. With Acorn, and all the major networks backing their cause. Fair? I can't say, life ain't fair.

Rights are a human concept. In Nature, you have the right to make an attempt, any attempt. You have the responsibility to accept the consequences.

Am I a republican? Afraid not, true blue old school JFK liberal. Does Glenn Beck make sense to me? Sometimes he does.

Is he smearing people? I think he is but he seems to be begging them to come on or call in and debate with him. Instead, the whole network is spun as a propaganda machine without specific charges of bias on specific stories.

Rush? I think he's a bomb thrower. He does his job and sells ad time. The left has plenty of grenadiers among their own. Fox ain't real news but Olberman is...

Networks who never wanted to cover Wright, ACORN, VAN JONES, they are the real news. Says who? and what might be the reason for their preference?

Somebody explain to me why Governer Palin's daugher's sex life was relevant to the election but then Senator Obama's associations were not?

Heck, Fox news doesn't report most of the stuff the hard right cares about. Any one see the story on Fox about the court hearing scheduled in January over President Obama's elgibility to hold office? NO! No you did not because they did not run the story.

How about what'shisname the limousine love bandit? Not on Fox. Pro-gun news? Not on Fox.

Yet they are so right wing? Most of their audience isn't even republican. Geraldo - there's a hard core right winger for you.

We seem to have an administration that does not tolerate media that questions them. It's not a Democratic thing, unless Nixon was a closet Democrat. Maybe that's what he and J. Edgar were doing at Camp David......

Al Franken? Puhleeez! multiple recounts and heavy ACORN involvement. Yeah, O.K. he won. 312 votes. Were any of those cast by Donald Duck? Because experience with ACORN voter fraud may tend to indicate it was really more like 311. Or maybe.....

I can't defend Van Jones, William Ayres, Jeremia Wright, Tony Resco, putting a man 12 days older than me in the White House, Kevin Jennings.

I can't defend the media chanting over and over that McCain was Bush. I can't defend reporters with tingling legs who are supposed to be watchdogs.

I can't defend ACORN. That was long before the "video sting". Voter fraud ain't funny no matter who does it. It's wrong. Politicians who still back them after the convictions are wrong. They need a break. Don't worry, they made sure they still get paid. Just vote them out.

I can't call somebody a racist, nut job, hatemonger, or idiot when they disagree with me. Because I would like the same respect, too often not given these days.

Socialism does not work. Pure Free Markets do not work. ( anybody else see the history channel show explaining that the first armored car was used to mow down striking miners and their families? ) Extremes won't cut it. Attacking individuals instead of debating ideas is the problem.

Blacklisting people, attacking a network in broad general terms instead of laying out specific beefs, it's all so mind numbing.

Same with people who whine and trash the Speaker of the House, The President, and The Senate Majority Leader.

Republicans that spend like drunken sailors followed by democrats who made them look like penny pinchers. Shouting emotional arguments from the bully pulpits and taking our money, our lives, and our children's futures.

Blame Beck? I salute him for at least asking the questions. If he's wrong, let's lay it out. Attacking him personally? Shows a lack of substance on the arguments.

Do I like Glenn Beck? I haven't asked him to go fishing that's for sure.

Rarely always agree with most folks on either side of the aisle. Try to think for myself instead of letting the boob tube control my brain. Disagreement doesn't mean hatred and vitriol.

Resentment is like drinking a bottle of poison and hoping the other guy dies. Don't do it to yourself, and by proximity, those around you.

_rant_over_

John Smith
10-21-2009, 07:30 AM
Better ask ljb5, she seems to be the one who has the problem with it.



.
There's a difference between having the right to his own opinion vs having the right to his own facts.

That, I believe, is where we have the problem

He states a fact, that is NOT a fact, then bases his opinion on the false fact. He will misquote someone, then base his opinion on the misquote.

He does not deny his facts are frequently wrong. Now, if the fact is the basis for the opinion, and the fact is wrong, then the opinion, although he's entitled to it, has no factual foundation.

John Smith
10-21-2009, 07:33 AM
So, basically you're just saying that no one can ever mention Mao under and circumstances?

Gee, I dunno what to tell you. Bush and Rove, Atwater and Dunn, McCain and Goldwater....

You're facing quite a tide. I predict you're going to be lonely and unhappy.

Still, you haven't answered my question: Do you really believe she idolizes Mao, or are you just drumming up a fight?
There's a narrow mindedness at work.

We can certainly learn from brilliant people who did very bad things.

John Smith
10-21-2009, 07:37 AM
Glenn Beck is an interesting commentator. When I'm on the road before noon I alternate radio buttons between him and Dennis Miller with no particular preference trying to avoid commercials. What I hear from him is fairly decent and definitely pro-American.

I rarely get to see his television program because I'm rarely home by the time it's over. When able to catch it, his show isn't bad. Certainly not something I set on the DVR, but you guys have me thinking about possibly recording some shows to keep track of what all the fuss from the LW and Whitehouse is about.

Like anything you see on television, it's best to stay a bit skeptical and keep an open mind.


.
Who's said he's not pro-American? Who isn't? That doesn't mean he doesn't make **** up.

John Smith
10-21-2009, 07:41 AM
I can't know what is in Anita Dunn's heart and mind. I can't help what it means to me when I saw her speech to those High School students.

When I was in High School, I would have thought that was cool. If you're not a socialist by age twenty, you have no heart. If you're still a socialist at age thirty, you have no head. ( wish I could remember who I stole that gem from)

High School was a few decades back for me. I no longer think it's cool. My bad? If you say so, whatever gets you through the night.

We did have an election. Democrats did win. With Acorn, and all the major networks backing their cause. Fair? I can't say, life ain't fair.

Rights are a human concept. In Nature, you have the right to make an attempt, any attempt. You have the responsibility to accept the consequences.

Am I a republican? Afraid not, true blue old school JFK liberal. Does Glenn Beck make sense to me? Sometimes he does.

Is he smearing people? I think he is but he seems to be begging them to come on or call in and debate with him. Instead, the whole network is spun as a propaganda machine without specific charges of bias on specific stories.

Rush? I think he's a bomb thrower. He does his job and sells ad time. The left has plenty of grenadiers among their own. Fox ain't real news but Olberman is...

Networks who never wanted to cover Wright, ACORN, VAN JONES, they are the real news. Says who? and what might be the reason for their preference?

Somebody explain to me why Governer Palin's daugher's sex life was relevant to the election but then Senator Obama's associations were not?

Heck, Fox news doesn't report most of the stuff the hard right cares about. Any one see the story on Fox about the court hearing scheduled in January over President Obama's elgibility to hold office? NO! No you did not because they did not run the story.

How about what'shisname the limousine love bandit? Not on Fox. Pro-gun news? Not on Fox.

Yet they are so right wing? Most of their audience isn't even republican. Geraldo - there's a hard core right winger for you.

We seem to have an administration that does not tolerate media that questions them. It's not a Democratic thing, unless Nixon was a closet Democrat. Maybe that's what he and J. Edgar were doing at Camp David......

Al Franken? Puhleeez! multiple recounts and heavy ACORN involvement. Yeah, O.K. he won. 312 votes. Were any of those cast by Donald Duck? Because experience with ACORN voter fraud may tend to indicate it was really more like 311. Or maybe.....

I can't defend Van Jones, William Ayres, Jeremia Wright, Tony Resco, putting a man 12 days older than me in the White House, Kevin Jennings.

I can't defend the media chanting over and over that McCain was Bush. I can't defend reporters with tingling legs who are supposed to be watchdogs.

I can't defend ACORN. That was long before the "video sting". Voter fraud ain't funny no matter who does it. It's wrong. Politicians who still back them after the convictions are wrong. They need a break. Don't worry, they made sure they still get paid. Just vote them out.

I can't call somebody a racist, nut job, hatemonger, or idiot when they disagree with me. Because I would like the same respect, too often not given these days.

Socialism does not work. Pure Free Markets do not work. ( anybody else see the history channel show explaining that the first armored car was used to mow down striking miners and their families? ) Extremes won't cut it. Attacking individuals instead of debating ideas is the problem.

Blacklisting people, attacking a network in broad general terms instead of laying out specific beefs, it's all so mind numbing.

Same with people who whine and trash the Speaker of the House, The President, and The Senate Majority Leader.

Republicans that spend like drunken sailors followed by democrats who made them look like penny pinchers. Shouting emotional arguments from the bully pulpits and taking our money, our lives, and our children's futures.

Blame Beck? I salute him for at least asking the questions. If he's wrong, let's lay it out. Attacking him personally? Shows a lack of substance on the arguments.

Do I like Glenn Beck? I haven't asked him to go fishing that's for sure.

Rarely always agree with most folks on either side of the aisle. Try to think for myself instead of letting the boob tube control my brain. Disagreement doesn't mean hatred and vitriol.

Resentment is like drinking a bottle of poison and hoping the other guy dies. Don't do it to yourself, and by proximity, those around you.

_rant_over_
Silly rant. FOX ran plenty on Obama's birth. They stopped because even their audience has been convinced he was born in Hawaii.

A lot of stuff reported on ACORN turned out to be less than accurate.

I'd go on, but there's no point.

John Smith
10-21-2009, 07:42 AM
Anyone notice the polls that show only 20% of Americans identify themselves as republicans?

Guess Beck's had a hand in that.

I, Rowboat
10-21-2009, 08:51 AM
FYI... Beck once said he hated the two party system in our country because all it did was polarize the country and cause people to be on one side or another rather than just focus on whats best for America.

And clearly, he's working to diffuse that polarity, to bridge that political divide, right?:rolleyes:

Gawd. Utter buffoonery, Beck, you, Rick-Mi. Are we even members of the same species? I hope not. It sure would be comforting to know for certain that would be no way your kids could breed with my kids.

Keith Wilson
10-21-2009, 08:57 AM
Perldog, you speak of what you know nothing about when you talk abut the Minnesota senate race between Al Franken and Norm Coleman. Minnesota elections are as squeaky-clean as anywhere on the planet. That was simply a very close election; every single ballot was gone over individually several times with representatives of both sides present, and the recount process was as about as fair as it's possible for human beings to make it. That's one reason the damn thing took almost forever. And I'd say exactly the same thing had Coleman won. (Norm Coleman's not a bad guy, BTW; under different cirucmstances I might have voted for him.)

A point about Acorn and the allegations of voter fraud - there was no voter fraud. Not one single person has ever been shown to have cast a vote improperly because of Acorn's activities. They collected some bogus voter registrations, and that certainly was a screwup - but they are required by law to turn in every single registration they collect. Sorting them out is not their job, it's the job of the government, and that's exactly how it must be.

RodB
10-21-2009, 09:36 AM
Re: Blaming Beck
I can't know what is in Anita Dunn's heart and mind. I can't help what it means to me when I saw her speech to those High School students.

When I was in High School, I would have thought that was cool. If you're not a socialist by age twenty, you have no heart. If you're still a socialist at age thirty, you have no head. ( wish I could remember who I stole that gem from)

High School was a few decades back for me. I no longer think it's cool. My bad? If you say so, whatever gets you through the night.

We did have an election. Democrats did win. With Acorn, and all the major networks backing their cause. Fair? I can't say, life ain't fair.

Rights are a human concept. In Nature, you have the right to make an attempt, any attempt. You have the responsibility to accept the consequences.

Am I a republican? Afraid not, true blue old school JFK liberal. Does Glenn Beck make sense to me? Sometimes he does.

Is he smearing people? I think he is but he seems to be begging them to come on or call in and debate with him. Instead, the whole network is spun as a propaganda machine without specific charges of bias on specific stories.

Rush? I think he's a bomb thrower. He does his job and sells ad time. The left has plenty of grenadiers among their own. Fox ain't real news but Olberman is...

Networks who never wanted to cover Wright, ACORN, VAN JONES, they are the real news. Says who? and what might be the reason for their preference?

Somebody explain to me why Governer Palin's daugher's sex life was relevant to the election but then Senator Obama's associations were not?

Heck, Fox news doesn't report most of the stuff the hard right cares about. Any one see the story on Fox about the court hearing scheduled in January over President Obama's elgibility to hold office? NO! No you did not because they did not run the story.

How about what'shisname the limousine love bandit? Not on Fox. Pro-gun news? Not on Fox.

Yet they are so right wing? Most of their audience isn't even republican. Geraldo - there's a hard core right winger for you.

We seem to have an administration that does not tolerate media that questions them. It's not a Democratic thing, unless Nixon was a closet Democrat. Maybe that's what he and J. Edgar were doing at Camp David......

Al Franken? Puhleeez! multiple recounts and heavy ACORN involvement. Yeah, O.K. he won. 312 votes. Were any of those cast by Donald Duck? Because experience with ACORN voter fraud may tend to indicate it was really more like 311. Or maybe.....

I can't defend Van Jones, William Ayres, Jeremia Wright, Tony Resco, putting a man 12 days older than me in the White House, Kevin Jennings.

I can't defend the media chanting over and over that McCain was Bush. I can't defend reporters with tingling legs who are supposed to be watchdogs.

I can't defend ACORN. That was long before the "video sting". Voter fraud ain't funny no matter who does it. It's wrong. Politicians who still back them after the convictions are wrong. They need a break. Don't worry, they made sure they still get paid. Just vote them out.

I can't call somebody a racist, nut job, hatemonger, or idiot when they disagree with me. Because I would like the same respect, too often not given these days.

Socialism does not work. Pure Free Markets do not work. ( anybody else see the history channel show explaining that the first armored car was used to mow down striking miners and their families? ) Extremes won't cut it. Attacking individuals instead of debating ideas is the problem.

Blacklisting people, attacking a network in broad general terms instead of laying out specific beefs, it's all so mind numbing.

Same with people who whine and trash the Speaker of the House, The President, and The Senate Majority Leader.

Republicans that spend like drunken sailors followed by democrats who made them look like penny pinchers. Shouting emotional arguments from the bully pulpits and taking our money, our lives, and our children's futures.

Blame Beck? I salute him for at least asking the questions. If he's wrong, let's lay it out. Attacking him personally? Shows a lack of substance on the arguments.

Do I like Glenn Beck? I haven't asked him to go fishing that's for sure.

Rarely always agree with most folks on either side of the aisle. Try to think for myself instead of letting the boob tube control my brain. Disagreement doesn't mean hatred and vitriol.

Resentment is like drinking a bottle of poison and hoping the other guy dies. Don't do it to yourself, and by proximity, those around you.

_rant_over_
__________________
Philanthropist, Thief, and Archer

Lots more truth in this "rant" than you might like to admit... LOTs!

Keith... come on man, you voted for Al Franken??? The mans a pathological liar...

RodB

Keith Wilson
10-21-2009, 12:14 PM
The mans a pathological liar... No, he's not. No more the Anita Dunn is a Maoist.

pefjr
10-21-2009, 12:37 PM
Anyone notice the polls that show only 20% of Americans identify themselves as republicans?

that was just the blue dogs.:D

bobbys
10-21-2009, 01:23 PM
Beck is a Nazis. His followers are Nazis..

Is that you today Memphis Mike or is it Jack Daniels today?.

We are Brooks Brothers mobsters not Nazis.

bobbys
10-21-2009, 01:32 PM
James, coming from you I'll take that as a compliment. That's the reason I like to come here from time to time, it's entertaining in a perverse sort of way witnessing just how ignorant liberals are when it comes to the principles that uphold freedom and how intellectually dishonest the far left can be with themselves and others. I'm sorry to be so blunt, but the term "useful idiots" certainly applies. I don't say this lightly, you are a dangerous bunch when it comes to the future of freedom and liberty in America.


..

I dont think you understand the plan here.

A lib attacks Glenn Beck or Sarah Palin or Rush or any up and coming conservative with personal venomous attacks.

Thus we are in the defensive position, Any rebuttal is jeered with attacks on you and your intelligence.

Thus distracting the real issues with the real people with the power.

If it can be "proved" the conservative lies or even if they make it up or just keep repeating it "proves" there guy is right by default..

Notice the rage against Beck, That means he is on to something.

ljb5
10-21-2009, 01:35 PM
The mans a pathological liar...


No, he's not. No more the Anita Dunn is a Maoist.

It's difficult to say exactly what Beck's condition is.... but it's easy to know what he's not. He's not relentlessly honest.

He might not be a liar per se, but he's willing to push the envelop in that direction much farther than an honest man would.

He clipped the Anita Dunn quote to change the meaning. There's a big difference between:

"...the two people I turn to most..."
"...the two people I turn to most to basically deliver a simple point...."


Beck said Mao was her "hero" and that she "idolizes" and "worships" Mao.

That's pure BS. He has stepped way over the line there by distorting a simple statement into evidence of hero worship.

A couple of people here on this forum fell for it, which doesn't make them look too good either.

pefjr
10-21-2009, 01:50 PM
[quote=ljb5;2358688]

"...the two people I turn to most to basically deliver a simple point...."

quote]I wonder? hmmm....... Why would an intellectual such as this fine lady dun need to turn to anyone to deliver a simple basic point? :D

ljb5
10-21-2009, 01:54 PM
I wonder? hmmm....... Why would an intellectual such as this fine lady dun need to turn to anyone to deliver a simple basic point? :D


You seriously wonder about that, or you're just being a doofus?

Milo Christensen
10-21-2009, 02:11 PM
Yeeeehaaaaaa! The new HD TV Marilyn ordered just came to the door! If I can figure out how to hook all the cables up and get it to work with the cable box, I can watch my first Glenn Beck in High Definition. But I gots to hustle, he's on at 5. GB in HD, how freakin' cool is that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Rick-Mi
10-21-2009, 02:25 PM
James, coming from you I'll take that as a compliment. That's the reason I like to come here from time to time, it's entertaining in a perverse sort of way witnessing just how ignorant liberals are when it comes to the principles that uphold freedom and how intellectually dishonest the far left can be with themselves and others. I'm sorry to be so blunt, but the term "useful idiots" certainly applies. I don't say this lightly, you are a dangerous bunch when it comes to the future of freedom and liberty in America.


.

I dont think you understand the plan here.

A lib attacks Glenn Beck or Sarah Palin or Rush or any up and coming conservative with personal venomous attacks.

Thus we are in the defensive position, Any rebuttal is jeered with attacks on you and your intelligence.

Thus distracting the real issues with the real people with the power.

If it can be "proved" the conservative lies or even if they make it up or just keep repeating it "proves" there guy is right by default..

Notice the rage against Beck, That means he is on to something.

I understand the point you are making here bobbys, but shining the light on people like Ms Dunn is actually very good even if the libs go into all out attack like the little Brownshirts they are. The secret is to bring out even more information about what some of radicals in the Obama administration have to say and believe. For years liberals in positions of power secretly kept it to themselves that they have never been proud of their country all their lives or that they admired people people like Chairman Mao or Karl Marx. We want more than Ms Dunn out of the closet. We need extreme radicals like Harold Koh, John Holdren, Mark Lloyd and others to be exposed. Furthermore, we need media sources like Glenn Beck and others to point this out to all of America. Let the "useful idiots" put up all the fuss they want as information goes out to the citizens to let them decide for themselves.

.

Rick-Mi
10-21-2009, 02:39 PM
Better learn to pick your battles better ;)




You've got it completely backwards. It's the left wingers who are the PC, "hate crime", "fairness doctrine" thought police!





There's Glen Beck... on TV, criticizing people for speaking their minds and expressing their opinions and even for signing a petition.

What laws have they broken? What is the justification for the attack?

Beck's problem isn't so much that he's loose with the facts (he hardly uses any at all). His main problem is that he's too firm with the opinions.

When Michelle Obama made some comments about how she felt about growing up in America, Beck went absolutely ape****.

Why? Well Ms. Obama's experiences and opinions were different than Beck's. Beck went on and on about how he felt about America.... and said it was wrong of Michelle to feel differently.

What right does he have to tell her how she ought to feel??

Why can't he see that she has her own experiences and her own reasons and she has a right to feel the way she does and express her opinions?

Why does he think she is wrong to feel differently than he does?

Beck wants to be the thought police. He attacks other people for seeing things differently than he does.


That has to be one of the stupidest arguments I've ever seen and clearly not a genuine example of thought police. Looks like you were caught off script and unable to "link to think". Better stick to being a global warming dupe, an issue favorable to obfuscation.


:D

Robmill0605
10-21-2009, 02:46 PM
Hmmm... the 'useful idiots' aren't citizens? Didn't they vote in large numbers for Obama, along with Democratic majorities in both the House and the Senate?
Not for long.
According to latest polls, the "useful idiot's' who voted for Obama and the democrats in both houses are 48 percent AGAINST his policies now.
Hence the rush to push through the agenda before Obama loses the majority's in 2010.

High C
10-21-2009, 02:49 PM
I agree with Norman. The useful idiots ARE citizens.

Keith Wilson
10-21-2009, 02:49 PM
Well, this is certainly informative. Beck claims, on the basis on one paragraph (well, a partial paragraph, carefully edited), that Ms. Dunn is actually a Maoist. Nothing to support the accusation; no reference to anything else she might have said or done for the rest of her life. And when people object that this is unjust - they're "little brownshirts", and you take the objections as evidence that Beck is right! (You do know who the real brownshirts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturmabteilung)were and what they did, don't you?)

You guys are out of your damn minds. No only do you not understand those who disagree with you; in fact, it appears that you don't even have any desire to understand them. Well, have it your way.

pefjr
10-21-2009, 02:52 PM
You seriously wonder about that, or you're just being a doofus?I was wondering an posting. Whatsa matta Mr. PHD you gotta try for the insult cause its a hard question for you to answer. Skip the post if'n it bothers ya. :D

bobbys
10-21-2009, 02:52 PM
I understand the point you are making here bobbys, but shining the light on people like Ms Dunn is actually very good even if the libs go into all out attack like the little Brownshirts they are. The secret is to bring out even more information about what some of radicals in the Obama administration have to say and believe. For years liberals in positions of power secretly kept it to themselves that they have never been proud of their country all their lives or that they admired people people like Chairman Mao or Karl Marx. We want more than Ms Dunn out of the closet. We need extreme radicals like Harold Koh, John Holdren, Mark Lloyd and others to be exposed. Furthermore, we need media sources like Glenn Beck and others to point this out to all of America. Let the "useful idiots" put up all the fuss they want as information goes out to the citizens to let them decide for themselves.

..

Perhaps i missed all the czars Quoting the Founding Fathers..

O wait they never do!!

Kaa
10-21-2009, 02:59 PM
He clipped the Anita Dunn quote to change the meaning. There's a big difference between:

"...the two people I turn to most..."
"...the two people I turn to most to basically deliver a simple point...."


Beck said Mao was her "hero" and that she "idolizes" and "worships" Mao.

Guess I shouldn't be surprised, but I'm kinda impressed by the breathtaking hypocrisy.

Complaining about clipped quotes, are you..?

Let's take a look (emphasis mine):



DUNN: A lot of you have a great deal of ability. A lot of you work hard. Put them together, and that answers the "Why not?" question. There's usually not a good reason.

And then the third lesson and tip actually come from two of my favorite political philosophers, Mao Zedong and Mother Teresa -- not often coupled with each together, but the two people that I turn to most to basically deliver a simple point, which is, you're going to make choices. You're going to challenge. You're going to say, "Why not?" You're going to figure out how to do things that have never been done before. But here's the deal: These are your choices. They are no one else's.

In 1947, when Mao Zedong was being challenged within his own party on his plan to basically take China over, Chiang Kai-shek and the Nationalist Chinese held the cities, they had the army, they had the air force, they had everything on their side. And people said, "How can you win? How can you do this? How can you do this against all of the odds against you?" And Mao Zedong said, you know, "You fight your war, and I'll fight mine." And think about that for a second.Yes, there's a big difference between just turning to Mao to deliver a simple point and calling him a favorite political philosopher.

By the way, did you believe Dunn when she said the mention of Mao was irony? I don't. She lied -- a deliberate, clumsy, stupid lie.

Kaa

Robmill0605
10-21-2009, 03:00 PM
I don't know what polls YOU are reading:

CNN Poll: Half the country disagrees with Obama on issues (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2009/10/20/cnn-poll-half-the-country-disagrees-with-obama-on-issues/)
Posted: October 20th, 2009 12:40 PM ET

From CNN Deputy Political Director Paul Steinhauser (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/tag/cnn-deputy-political-director-paul-steinhauser/)
http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2009/images/10/20/art.obama.1020.2.jpg CNN Poll: Half the country disagrees with Obama on issues.

http://i.l.cnn.net/cnn/.element/img/2.0/mosaic/base_skins/baseplate/corner_wire_BL.gif

WASHINGTON (CNN) – For the first time since he took over in the White House, Americans don't see eye to eye with President Barack Obama on the important issues, according to a new national poll. But the CNN/Opinion Research Corporation survey does indicate that a majority approve of how Obama's handling his duties as president.
According to the poll, which was released Tuesday, 48 percent of people questioned say that they agree with Obama on the issues that matter most to them, with 51 percent saying no. That's a switch from April, when 57 percent said they agreed with the president on important issues, with 41 percent disagreeing.

High C
10-21-2009, 03:00 PM
Well, this is certainly informative. Beck claims, on the basis on one paragraph (well, a partial paragraph, carefully edited), that Ms. Dunn is actually a Maoist....

Keith, I don't give a tinker's damn about Glen Beck. I don't know who he is or what he has to say, except from what I hear from liberals on this forum. He is irrelevant.

What IS relevant is the video recording of Dunn, reading her written, prepared speech. THAT is the issue, not what Beck has to say about it. There is no dispute about what she said, it's on the tape.

I don't like it. I think it's EXTREMELY worrisome that a major Presidential appointee would write down, and read back to a group of school kids, that she finds Mao one of her favorite political philosophers.

As others have pointed out, you would be going BANANAS had a Bush appointee said the same of Hitler, who by the way killed fewer people than did Mao.

For you to continue to harp on this Beck guy, and not address the real issue, which is the actual recording of the speech, must mean that you have nothing substantive to offer in her defense. Otherwise, why battle the strawman?

Me thinks thy protest rings hollow.

Keith Wilson
10-21-2009, 03:06 PM
Kaa, I thought you were above this kind of stuff. The juxtaposition of Mother Teresa and Chairman Mao, two people who very obviously have almost nothing in common, makes it obvious - or well, it should make it obvious - that it's ironic. :rolleyes:

HighC, I posted the text of the speech first. The bit about "not addressing the real issue" is nonsense. OK, so you think Ms. Dunn is actually a Maoist. Evidence please. One quote is not sufficient. And you're 100% wrong about the hypothetical Bush appointee quote; I don't do "gotchas" with one sentence. Everyone sometimes says something that comes out wrong, and pretending that such things reveal a secret agenda is just harebrained.

High C
10-21-2009, 03:13 PM
Norman and Keith, you are both arguing dishonestly, attempting to make me defend things I did not say.

I did not call Dunn a Maoist, and I did not say that she idolizes Mao.

My words were accurate. Yours were not.

Rick-Mi
10-21-2009, 03:13 PM
You guys are out of your damn minds. No only do you not understand those who disagree with you; in fact, it appears that you don't even have any desire to understand them. Well, have it your way.

You are right Keith, some Americans have no desire to "understand" or relate to people who look up to Chairman Mao or for whatever reason do not understand the principles that made America great (excuse me, I realize you might take issue with the statement that America is great).

When talking about the constitution, which defends the liberty of each individual from government and the tyranny of the majority some people make statements such as:


"faithfulness to the original intent" is a profoundly silly idea.

and when someone calls the US constitution "special" some respond by calling it:


Pseudo-religious idolatry


I say people with such little regard for the principles that uphold our freedom are outright dangerous to the future of America. Why should citizens who consider it their duty to defend the liberty which was passed down to them at the cost of much blood and treasure want to relate to those who seek to undermine it?


.







__________________

Kaa
10-21-2009, 03:25 PM
Kaa, I thought you were above this kind of stuff. The juxtaposition of Mother Teresa and Chairman Mao, two people who very obviously have almost nothing in common, makes it obvious - or well, it should make it obvious - that it's ironic. :rolleyes:

I don't think so at all -- I am pretty sure she's dead serious. There's a video, you know, you can watch her facial expression. Clearly she understands Mao and Mother Teresa are very different and is playing off this contrast, but there's nothing to indicate that when she says Mao is one of her favorite political philosophers she doesn't mean it, that it's a joke. It's not a joke. I rather suspect that she thinks herself particularly broadminded for having two such different people as her favorite philosophers.

Now, this is a witch hunt and I'm very much not in favor of witch hunts and ideological purity tests. I'm not passing judgement on either Ms.Dunn or her suitability for her position. I don't know anything about her other than that she seems to like Mao and that she has demonstrated political clumsiness -- the second sin being much more important than the first one in Washington -- and so I have no opinion on her competence or on whether she should stay or resign.

However the left's defense of her is no less clumsy than her "irony" lie. The correct response would have been -- "yeah, she said she liked Mao -- SO WHAT?" Instead you have more and more absurd contortions to prove that the meaning of "is" depends. And *that* I will point my finger at and laugh.

Kaa

Kaa
10-21-2009, 03:28 PM
I say people with such little regard for the principles that uphold our freedom are outright dangerous to the future of America.

Off with their heads!

Let's have a purge to cleanse our America of these parasites!

Kaa

Keith Wilson
10-21-2009, 03:31 PM
I did not call Dunn a Maoist, and I did not say that she idolizes Mao.OK, fair enough. You said this.
I don't like it. I think it's EXTREMELY worrisome that a major Presidential appointee would write down, and read back to a group of school kids, that she finds Mao one of her favorite political philosophers.Mao and Mother Teresa. Unless Mother Theresa was also a Maoist, that's king of an ironic combination, eh? And look at the point she made, by referencing both of them. It's so innocuous as to be almost a platitude.

Again, if there's any evidence that Ms. Dunn holds unsavory ideas other than this one quote, please provide it. Everyone occasionally says things that come out wrong, or can be deliberately misinterpreted in order to sound bad.

High C
10-21-2009, 03:32 PM
Fair enough. you didn't say she 'idolized Mao'. You did explicitly presume that she was being serious when she said she considered Mao to be one of her favorite philosophers....

.....and that still means you're either deliberately ingenuous, or tone deaf about 'figures of speech' and metaphors.

Never mind.... this is truly stupid....

ROTFLMAO! :D You're right about that...extremely stupid. Your laughable "metaphor" and "figure of speech" idea is one of the most absurdly partisan attempts at straw grasping I've ever seen on this forum. :D

Kaa
10-21-2009, 03:34 PM
You did explicitly presume that she was being serious when she said she considered Mao to be one of her favorite philosophers....

.....and that still means you're either deliberately ingenuous, or tone deaf about 'figures of speech' and metaphors.

Norman, in post #154 there is the quote with context. Can you explain to me how Mao is a metaphor or a figure of speech..? In detail, please -- for example, "A metaphor is a figure of speech concisely comparing two things, saying that one is the other", so is Mao one of those things? What is the other one? What's the point of the comparison?

Kaa

High C
10-21-2009, 03:34 PM
....Everyone occasionally says things that come out wrong, or can be deliberately misinterpreted in order to sound bad.

Picture the Bush official/Hitler equivalent, Keith...just picture it. How would you have reacted? Be honest. You would have flipped you lid and you know it.

Rick-Mi
10-21-2009, 03:36 PM
I say people with such little regard for the principles that uphold our freedom are outright dangerous to the future of America.


Off with their heads!

Let's have a purge to cleanse our America of these parasites!

Kaa


"Purge", "cleanse", those are your words Kaa, not mine.....


.

Keith Wilson
10-21-2009, 03:38 PM
You would have flipped you lid and you know it. Some would have, certainly. I don't do "gotcha" quotes, whether or not I like or agree with the person. Honestly. It's a tactic I particularly dislike, whoever does it.

Now when someone is very clear and unambiguous and says exactly what they mean without any possibility of misunderstanding - and it's still off the wall, and corresponds with other things they've said and done, that's another matter.



Thanks, Rick. I'm very pleased to be dangerous to the sort of US you apparently wish to create. I will do what I can to thwart you and those who think like you.

Kaa
10-21-2009, 03:44 PM
"Purge", "cleanse", those are your words Kaa, not mine...

Well, what do you do with people who are outright dangerous to the future of your beloved country, then?

Kaa

pefjr
10-21-2009, 03:51 PM
Well, what do you do with people who are outright dangerous to the future of your beloved country, then?

Kaacall um dirty names on WB forum.:D

Rick-Mi
10-21-2009, 04:12 PM
Well, what do you do with people who are outright dangerous to the future of your beloved country, then?

Kaa


If you want to add bombshell phrases with negative connotations to a lively discussion about the need for "understanding" between ideological opposites feel free, but keep me out of it.


.

Kaa
10-21-2009, 04:12 PM
OK, fair enough. You said this.Mao and Mother Teresa. Unless Mother Theresa was also a Maoist, that's king of an ironic combination, eh?

Would you care to point out the irony to me, Keith?



DUNN: A lot of you have a great deal of ability. A lot of you work hard. Put them together, and that answers the "Why not?" question. There's usually not a good reason. ...

In 1947, when Mao Zedong was being challenged within his own party on his plan to basically take China over, Chiang Kai-shek and the Nationalist Chinese held the cities, they had the army, they had the air force, they had everything on their side. And people said, "How can you win? How can you do this? How can you do this against all of the odds against you?" And Mao Zedong said, you know, "You fight your war, and I'll fight mine." And think about that for a second.

You know, you don't have to accept the definition of how to do things, and you don't have to follow other people's choices and paths, OK? It is about your choices and your path. You fight your own war. You lay out your own path. You figure out what's right for you. You don't let external definition define how good you are internally. You fight your war. You let them fight theirs. Everybody has their own path.Kaa

Kaa
10-21-2009, 04:14 PM
If you want to add bombshell phrases with negative connotations to a lively discussion about the need for "understanding" between ideological opposites feel free, but keep me out of it.

I asked you a question using your phrases. Feel free to answer it without using bombshells and negative connotations.

Kaa

ljb5
10-21-2009, 04:15 PM
I don't think so at all -- I am pretty sure she's dead serious.

Well, now we know what type of dupe you are.


There's a video, you know, you can watch her facial expression. Clearly she understands Mao and Mother Teresa are very different and is playing off this contrast, but there's nothing to indicate that when she says Mao is one of her favorite political philosophers she doesn't mean it, that it's a joke.

The audience laughed. They got it.

She played if for laughs and she got a laugh.

See for yourself. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fi1zg2NOCn8)


The statement was obviously irony because Mother Teresa and Mao have virtually nothing in common.
It was played for laughs.
She did not even say anything about his political philosophy
The people in the room with her at the time understood it was irony and laughed.
She explained later that it was irony.
Glenn Beck edited the quote to change the meaning.
Glenn Beck applied the words "hero" and "idolize" without justification.


It has now been explained to you many times. Any further difficulty you're having is your own problem.

Keith Wilson
10-21-2009, 04:26 PM
Jesus H. Christ, Kaa, now you're using partial quotes! The irony was in this bit:
The third lesson and tip actually come from two of my favorite political philosophers: Mao Tse-tung and Mother Teresa. (audience laughs) Not often coupled with each other. As for the rest of it; what's wrong with it? Mao's strategy suceeded. It suceeded for a very bad cause, but that's irrelevant to the point she's making, which is a good one.
You know, you don't have to accept the definition of how to do things, and you don't have to follow other people's choices and paths, OK? It is about your choices and your path. You fight your own war. You lay out your own path. You figure out what's right for you. You don't let external definition define how good you are internally. You fight your war. You let them fight theirs. Everybody has their own path. You have a problem with that?

ljb5
10-21-2009, 04:30 PM
Picture the Bush official/Hitler equivalent, Keith...just picture it. How would you have reacted? Be honest. You would have flipped you lid and you know it.

If we had reason to believe he meant is seriously, we would have flipped out.

(If you had a shred of integrity, you would too.... but I'm not banking on that. I suspect you would have supported him.)

The key factor is having a reason to believe it was meant seriously. The idea of a key government official in the United States being a sincere Maoist is so absurd as to force us to examine the entire quote and context.

In this case, we have examined the quote and context (something Glenn Beck refused to do) and it's obvious she isn't a Maoist. She didn't even talk about Mao's political philosophy... just his approach to a seemingly insurmountable problem.

We didn't flip out when McCain quoted Mao. I don't remember you expressing any outrage at the time either.

Why the double standard?

Kaa
10-21-2009, 04:36 PM
Jesus H. Christ, Kaa, now you're using partial quotes. The irony was in this bit As for the rest of it; what's wrong with it?

Um, I hate to point out obvious things, but but if you're ironic about joining two different people ("oh, you know I'm a great fan of Gandhi and Hitler"), you do NOT follow with an example of how your anti-hero was the embodiment of the point you're making, and did all the right things, and succeeded.

She just used a classic dear-Great-Leader story -- how the Great Leader went across the grain in his younger days and succeeded against all odds because he's such a genius and loved the revolution and the people. We should all strive to be like the Great Leader!

Kaa

Rick-Mi
10-21-2009, 04:40 PM
I asked you a question using your phrases. Feel free to answer it without using bombshells and negative connotations.
Kaa

After you injected the following comment toward a discussion Keith and I were having about "understanding" between ideological opposites you are on your own.



Off with their heads!

Let's have a purge to cleanse our America of these parasites!

Kaa


If you think it fitting to make loaded statement such as what we see above on your own account, it's a free country. Just don't expect a serious reply from me on follow up questions. Imagine any answer you wish.....


.

Kaa
10-21-2009, 04:43 PM
Imagine any answer you wish...

Hmm... re-education camps?

Did I guess correctly? :D

Kaa

ljb5
10-21-2009, 04:45 PM
Wow. In a discussion with Kaa, Rick-Mi sounds like the sane one.

We have truly gone through the looking glass!

pefjr
10-21-2009, 04:49 PM
Well, now we know what type of dupe you are.



Does she chew tobacco when speaking? Maybe Redman?
:D

Milo Christensen
10-21-2009, 04:50 PM
I dint get the nu teevee hoked up in tim, whut I miss on Beck tuday?

Rick-Mi
10-21-2009, 04:50 PM
Wow. In a discussion with Kaa, Rick-Mi sounds like the sane one.

We have truly gone through the looking glass!



It might be a good idea to save some face and cut your losses......


.

Keith Wilson
10-21-2009, 04:53 PM
Um, I hate to point out obvious things, but but if you're ironic about joining two different people ("oh, you know I'm a great fan of Gandhi and Hitler"), you do NOT follow with an example of how your anti-hero was the embodiment of the point you're making, and did all the right things, and succeeded.Sure you do - if one makes the point that Mao and Mother Teresa said roughly the same thing (on this one point), and had success achieving their very different ends because of it. Quite ordinary use of irony. If you or I did it here, nobody would notice or care.

Once again, does anyone have the slightest shred of evidence other than this one quote that Ms Dunn is actually an admirer of Mao?

ljb5
10-21-2009, 04:54 PM
It might be a good idea to save some face and cut your losses......


Yup, I've been telling you that since the beginning.

That's why I asked you a simple question, which you refused to answer:

Do you really think she's a Maoist, or are you just trying to find something to attack?

Seriously dude, a genuine Maoist? Do you really believe that? Do you think she carries the little red book and wears the hat and jacket?

I suspect that, deep down, you know that's preposterous.

Kaa
10-21-2009, 05:14 PM
Sure you do - if one makes the point that Mao and Mother Teresa said roughly the same thing (on this one point), and had success achieving their very different ends because of it. Quite ordinary use of irony.

I think we'll have to disagree on that...

As an aside, I've looked for the origin of the Mao's quote. And, I guess, it's possible that he did say it in 1947, but I've dug out two other versions.

Version 1 says:


In 1946, George Marshall tried to negotiate a coalition government agreement in China between Chiang Kai-shek's Kuomintang government and the Communists under Mao Zedong, who was the ultimate practitioner of insurgency warfare in the 20th century, along with Tito in Yugoslavia and Ho Chi-minh in Vietnam.
When the discussions crumbled, Marshall told Mao that his coalition initiative had ended, and the US would supply conventional arms to the Kuomintang to fight the Communists.
Mao responded: "You fight your war, and I'll fight my war. We'll see who wins."
Three years later, in 1949, the People's Republic of China was founded. Mao had switched from a guerrilla war, then to conventional warfare, and won. (http://turcopolier.typepad.com/sic_semper_tyrannis/2007/01/quadrillage.html)

This version is a bit weak, being basically a post on someone's blog without any attributions.

More likely is version 2 where in his speech to the 9th Session of the Central People's Government Committee on 5 September 1950, Mao said:


We don't want to fight you [US imperialists], but if you insist on a fight then you'll get one. You fight your war and we'll fight ours. You use your atomic weapons and we'll use hand grenades. We will find your weak spot. We will come after you, and in the end we will defeat you. (http://www.defence.gov.au/army/ahu/docs/The_Korean_War_1950_1953_McLeod.pdf)

Interesting...

Kaa

ishmael
10-21-2009, 09:27 PM
I find it neither funny nor ironic when a top appointee of this administration says that she admires Mao.

I read a lot of Mao in college. I took a semester long class titled "Classical East Asian Thought." The teacher, a contract worker, was an avowed Communist, and ironically reputed to be a CIA agent. We read a lot of Mao. There's no doubt Mao was a smart fellow, and he wrote a good game, but look at what he did!

ljb5
10-21-2009, 09:43 PM
There's no doubt Mao was a smart fellow, and he wrote a good game, but look at what he did!

George Washington and Thomas Jefferson owned slaves.

Such a strange reality we live in.

Milo Christensen
10-21-2009, 09:48 PM
George Washington and Thomas Jefferson owned slaves.

Such a strange reality we live in.

You'll have noted, no doubt, that Anita didn't list either of those two in her personal favorite political philosophers.

ljb5
10-21-2009, 09:51 PM
You'll have noted, no doubt, that Anita didn't list either of those two in her personal favorite political philosophers.

Indeed, for surely Glenn Beck would have blown a gasket if a highly placed government official expressed admiration for a slave owner!

Milo Christensen
10-21-2009, 09:58 PM
Indeed, for surely Glenn Beck would have blown a gasket if a highly placed government official expressed admiration for a slave owner!

Well, O'Reilly did have the next POTUS on tonight. Apparently Newt Gingrich has a new book about the 45th President's admiration for the first President.

ishmael
10-21-2009, 11:07 PM
Holding slaves, while a repugnant matter which Jefferson at least had strong moral qualms about, isn't the same as murdering millions of people, as Mao did. One can argue the moral gradation, but I'd rather be a slave to Jefferson than a Chinese citizen under Mao.

More importantly, I don't hear anyone arguing much that slavery was a good thing

ljb5
10-21-2009, 11:21 PM
More importantly, I don't hear anyone arguing much that slavery was a good thing

Nor did you hear anyone argue that Mao's Cultural Revolution was a good thing.

Well, maybe you did. You hear what you want to hear. :rolleyes:

You still haven't answered my question. Do you really believe she is a Maoist?

Or do you think maybe she's just a normal person who quoted Mao?

High C
10-22-2009, 08:08 AM
.....Do you really believe she is a Maoist?

Or do you think maybe she's just a normal person who quoted Mao?

Neither, you dishonest vanquisher of strawmen. She is a top government official who told a group of school kids that Mao is one of her top two favorite political philosophers.

Do you really think people don't spot your transparent attempts to change the argument to one that suits you, rather than dealing with the actual argument that is on the table?

Hint: NO

Keith Wilson
10-22-2009, 08:36 AM
who told a group of school kids that Mao is one of her top two favorite political philosophers.Mao and Mother Teresa.

Once again, is there the slightest bit of evidence, aside from this quote, that Ms. Dunn is actually an admirer of Mao? Anything at all?

Keith Wilson
10-22-2009, 08:59 AM
There does to be a certain perverse logic here. We've heard about the "extreme radical leftists" in the Obama administration; a truly absurd claim, on the order of saying they are really space aliens (reptilian overlords!) or disguised gorillas, and of course the rational response is "Huh? Sure, right, Maoists every one :rolleyes: (heavy sarcasm, in case anyone missed it)." So now we have "See? Anita Dunn mentioned Mao in a speech. She idolizes Mao! They really are all Maoists!! The Obama administration really is all radical extreme leftists!!"

It plays well with 10 or 20% of the population, I guess.

Gonzalo
10-22-2009, 09:35 AM
Apparently Dunn got the line from Lee Atwater and thought it was clever. Probably a stupid thing to say, clever or not, but I don't hear Beck castigating Atwater.

Politicians are in the business of talking, among other things. As such, they are bound to say something stupid now and then. Even Lee Atwater.

Rick-Mi
10-22-2009, 11:26 AM
Yup, I've been telling you that since the beginning.

That's why I asked you a simple question, which you refused to answer:

Do you really think she's a Maoist, or are you just trying to find something to attack?



The reason your question has been ignored is because it is based on a completely false premise. It's merely a silly attempt to grasp at straws while defending the indefensible.

Why on earth would Ms Dunn have to be a "Maoist" in order for freedom loving Americans to be disgusted with her personal reference to one of the most murderous communists of all time?

Try to take the blinders off for a moment. Do you libs really think a political opponent would have to be an actual Nazi in order for you Keith and Norm to be up in arms if they made a reference to Hitler as someone they look to and alluded to some experience from Mein Kampf?

I thank Bilge liberals for once again for exposing how intellectually dishonest the far left really is! Keep up the good work....


.

Keith Wilson
10-22-2009, 11:45 AM
in order for freedom loving Americans to be disgusted with her personal reference to one of the most murderous communists of all timeI am a freedom-loving American, and I understood what she meant and was not at all disgusted. And I have no more admiration for Mao than you do.

Once again, there are no representatives of the "far left" here. That would be a genuine Maoist.

ljb5
10-22-2009, 12:47 PM
Why on earth would Ms Dunn have to be a "Maoist" in order for freedom loving Americans to be disgusted with her personal reference to one of the most murderous communists of all time?

So you're saying you don't believe she's a Maoist? If she isn't a Maoist (or Marxist), why did Glenn Beck say she was?

The problem here isn't just that she made a reference to Mao....

...the problem is that Glenn Beck heard that reference and then exaggerated it to say:

she loves Mao
she idolizes Mao
she follows Mao
Mao is her hero
she wants to follow Mao's policies
she hates America
she is a revolutionary



What I am telling you now is that there are Marxist revolutionaries who have dedicated themselves to principles that will destroy our nation as we know it!

--Glenn Beck

You think maybe Glenn Beck has blown this a little bit out of proportion?

I understand if you don't like her quoting Mao... but there's a huge difference between that and what Beck claimed.

Kaa
10-22-2009, 01:21 PM
This is getting REALLY dumb!

Why, I agree :-)

May I repost the advice I gave some time ago?


The correct response would have been -- "yeah, she said she liked Mao -- SO WHAT?" Instead you have more and more absurd contortions to prove that the meaning of "is" depends.

How about that metaphor, Norman?

Kaa

Kaa
10-22-2009, 01:39 PM
It was a metaphor in the sense that 'Mao' was a stand-in for the sentiment expressed... and a metaphor is indeed a stand-in for something completely different.

:eek:

Tsk, tsk... I sense that you didn't follow my advice and figure out what a metaphor is.

Let's try some basic stuff.


Metaphors are comparisons that show how two things that are not alike in most ways are similar in one important way. Metaphors are a way to describe something. Authors use them to make their writing more interesting or entertaining. Unlike similes that use the words “as” or “like” to make a comparison, metaphors state that something is something else."A typical metaphor is Shakespeare's "All the world’s a stage..."

So, once again -- who Mao is compared to? Dunn says that he is... what or who? What is that important way in which he is similar to his comparison?

Kaa

ljb5
10-22-2009, 02:04 PM
Let's try some basic stuff.

A typical metaphor is Shakespeare's "All the world’s a stage..."

So, once again -- who Mao is compared to? Dunn says that he is... what or who? What is that important way in which he is similar to his comparison?

Now batting for the stupid team in the World Series of Obtuse....

Keith Wilson
10-22-2009, 02:15 PM
Kaa's just being ornery while dexterously splitting hairs into precise sixteenths. "Metaphor" isn't the right word; Mao wasn't used as a metaphor in the speech.

ljb5
10-22-2009, 02:48 PM
"Metaphor" isn't the right word; Mao wasn't used as a metaphor in the speech.

How about we just say "rhetorical flourish" and let it drop?

Kaa
10-22-2009, 03:31 PM
Kaa's just being ornery while dexterously splitting hairs into precise sixteenths. "Metaphor" isn't the right word; Mao wasn't used as a metaphor in the speech.

I wasn't going to pay much attention to it, since Norman was just repeating words he heard somewhere but had little idea as to what their actual meaning was. However in another thread, completely unprovoked, he decided to point out that I was so dumb I wasn't even able to understand the metaphor in Dunn's speech.

Well, then...

Kaa

Milo Christensen
10-22-2009, 08:11 PM
After 200 posts on Anita Dunn's Maoist tendencies, it's time to read the last few lines of this article. (http://features.csmonitor.com/politics/2009/10/22/who-is-anita-dunn/)Then laugh at ourselves.

ccmanuals
10-23-2009, 07:05 AM
I've installed a Red Telephone for Jessica Alba to call me anytime she wants to get laid. Doesn't mean I have a right to expect she will or act pouty if she doesn't

now that's funny!

Hot Air
10-23-2009, 07:16 AM
What are the chances that an American highschool audience would have any clue who the hell Mao was - let alone get the "irony," or "humor." And what is funny about saying that one of your favorite political philosophers is a man who ruled while millions died under his leadership?

Flying Orca
10-23-2009, 07:21 AM
Like FDR, you mean? Actually, come to think of it, I think millions have died under most presidents' leadership.

The thing about Mao, like it or not, agree with his preferred political system or not, is that he was an astute and practical political operator who tossed off pithy aphorisms like Wilde. The man is immensely quotable. I think most of the world is able to distinguish between lifting a good line from someone and slavish devotion to their entire philosophy, but then based on the art produced in the USA, there does seem to be a tin ear for subtext there...

Hot Air
10-23-2009, 07:31 AM
You are really comparing Mao to FDR? Amazing.

Flying Orca
10-23-2009, 07:31 AM
Your reading comprehension is that bad? Amazing.

Hot Air
10-23-2009, 07:39 AM
What is "astute" about killing millions to promote your ideology? I have spent a lot of time with many survivors of the Mao era. They don't seem look back on those days with fond memories of his "pithy" quotes. I bet you would have enjoyed the spectacle of a struggle session Orca as they were a "practical" way of destroying your class enemies.

pefjr
10-23-2009, 09:22 AM
[quote=Flying Orca;2360645]Like FDR, you mean? Actually, come to think of it, I think millions have died under most presidents' leadership.

quote]

Now , Orca , if you need some good quotes, try Yogi Berra my hero. And no one died. Except the Dodgers

A nickel ain't worth a dime anymore.


All pitchers are liars or crybabies.

Always go to other people's funerals, otherwise they won't come to yours.

Baseball is ninety percent mental and the other half is physical.

Congratulations. I knew the record would stand until it was broken.

Even Napoleon had his Watergate.

Half the lies they tell about me aren't true.

He hits from both sides of the plate. He's amphibious.

I always thought that record would stand until it was broken.

I just want to thank everyone who made this day necessary.


I never blame myself when I'm not hitting. I just blame the bat and if it keeps up, I change bats. After all, if I know it isn't my fault that I'm not hitting, how can I get mad at myself?

I never said most of the things I said.

I think Little League is wonderful. It keeps the kids out of the house.

I wish I had an answer to that because I'm tired of answering that question.

I'm a lucky guy and I'm happy to be with the Yankees. And I want to thank everyone for making this night necessary.


I'm not going to buy my kids an encyclopedia. Let them walk to school like I did.

If people don't want to come out to the ball park, nobody's gonna stop 'em.

If the world was perfect, it wouldn't be.


If you ask me anything I don't know, I'm not going to answer. If you come to a fork in the road, take it.


If you don't know where you are going, you might wind up someplace else.


In baseball, you don't know nothing.


In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is.


It ain't over till it's over.


It ain't the heat, it's the humility.


It gets late early out there.


It was impossible to get a conversation going, everybody was talking too much.

It's like deja-vu, all over again.


It's pretty far, but it doesn't seem like it.

Little League baseball is a very good thing because it keeps the parents off the streets.


Nobody goes there anymore. It's too crowded.


Slump? I ain't in no slump... I just ain't hitting.

So I'm ugly. So what? I never saw anyone hit with his face.


The future ain't what it used to be.

The only color I don't have is navy brown.

The other teams could make trouble for us if they win.


The towels were so thick there I could hardly close my suitcase.
There are some people who, if they don't already know, you can't tell 'em.


We have deep depth.



We made too many wrong mistakes.

When you arrive at a fork in the road, take it.

You better cut the pizza in four pieces because I'm not hungry enough to eat six.


You can observe a lot by just watching.

You should always go to other people's funerals, otherwise, they won't come to yours.


You wouldn't have won if we'd beaten you.

You've got to be very careful if you don't know where you are going, because you might not get there. :)

Flying Orca
10-23-2009, 11:39 AM
What is "astute" about killing millions to promote your ideology?

Did I say somewhere that "killing millions to promote your ideology" was astute? Seems to me I did not.

That being said, he won the civil war, didn't he? He assumed and held control of a huge country through some challenging times, too, if I'm not mistaken. He may not have governed from a philosophy that you (or for that matter, I) would support, but that's nothing to do with his political astuteness.


I have spent a lot of time with many survivors of the Mao era. They don't seem look back on those days with fond memories of his "pithy" quotes.

This says nothing about the quotes themselves.


I bet you would have enjoyed the spectacle of a struggle session Orca as they were a "practical" way of destroying your class enemies.

Now you're just being an offensive arse. You know next to nothing of me, my political views, or what I would or would not enjoy. Your demonstrated inability to grasp the nuances of my words in this forum excuses neither your pitiful command of rhetoric nor your lack of decent boundaries in conversation. One is tempted to conclude that the world will be a better place once you are gone.

pefjr
10-23-2009, 01:21 PM
One is tempted to conclude that the world will be a better place once you are gone. Orca

The leftist radicals are fired up today!!

Rick-Mi
10-23-2009, 01:49 PM
Like FDR, you mean? Actually, come to think of it, I think millions have died under most presidents' leadership.

Oh my gosh, <shaking head> I can barely believe what I just read!


The thing about Mao, like it or not, agree with his preferred political system or not, is that he was an astute and practical political operator who tossed off pithy aphorisms like Wilde. The man is immensely quotable.

Oh yea, just like Adolf I suppose.... :rolleyes:

This thread is truly unbelievable! Since slipping on deck and falling into the bilge, I've never seen anything like this topic where four forum left wingers; Keith, Norman, Flying Orca and bj5 have demonstrated such a lack of intellectual honesty or looked so foolish in an argument.

You people are giving credence to Michael Savage's assertion that liberalism is a mental disease.....


.

Rick-Mi
10-23-2009, 01:56 PM
One is tempted to conclude that the world will be a better place once you are gone.


The leftist radicals are fired up today!!


They sure are! "You fight your war, and I'll fight mine."



This thread has given us a peek into the liberal mind and it ain't pretty :eek:

Here is a guy putting Chairman Mao on par with FDR and then talking about how the world would be a better place when you are gone. Think about that for a second!


.

pefjr
10-23-2009, 02:14 PM
.


Think about that for a second!


.

No, it hurts!:D

ishmael
10-23-2009, 02:14 PM
"The thing about Mao, like it or not, agree with his preferred political system or not, is that he was an astute and practical political operator who tossed off pithy aphorisms like Wilde. The man is immensely quotable. I think most of the world is able to distinguish between lifting a good line from someone and slavish devotion to their entire philosophy,"

Like it or not? Have you read anything about what Mao said and did? By some estimates he was responsible for the murder of upward of 70 million Chinese people.

To be fair, I've not seen Ms. Dunn's speech, I've only read the transcripts. It's interesting that in the first days following it the Left was quiet about it, and now they are saying, "Oh, she was just joshing."

I don't think it was a joke. I think she got caught in a faux pas, her ideological knickers around her knees. I don't want her ilk in charge of my government. The fact that she was appointed, after I'm sure an extensive vetting, speaks ill of this president and his administration. Eat it however makes you more comfortable. Oh, and how about some Mein Kampf with a nice Idi Amin era coffee, for desert?

Flying Orca
10-23-2009, 02:23 PM
You guys are either unbelievably dense, trolling, or committed to advancing your dubiously supported views at the expense of the accurate representation of your opponent's position.

In other news, the Emperor is wearing no clothes.

Robmill0605
10-23-2009, 02:24 PM
The issue to me is that these are the people Obama is surrounding himself with, and is appointing these radical leftists Czars without Congressional oversight.
Why should anyone be surprised after Bill Ayers, Acorn, the Rev. Wright and more?

Go Glenn Beck.

Flying Orca
10-23-2009, 02:27 PM
If your idea of a "radical leftist" is anyone with the temerity to quote Mao-Tse Tung in service of a point, your political understanding has the depth of your average coat of varnish.

Keith Wilson
10-23-2009, 02:29 PM
This thread has given us a peek into the liberal mind and it ain't prettyNo. It has given us a peek into what some conservatives imagine the "liberal mind" to be like. It's the stuff of nightmares - frightening, but existing only inside the mind of the fearful one.

Once again, is there any shred of evidence, anything at all other than that one quote, to show that Ms. Dunn is a genuine admirer of Mao (and Mother Teresa)?

pefjr
10-23-2009, 02:47 PM
Lets take a peek.

Do you quote someone in the context that she was speaking, that you do not admire?

Kaa
10-23-2009, 02:53 PM
Lets take a peek.

Do you quote someone in the context that she was speaking, that you do not admire?

We've been over this multiple times.

Some people seem to be perfectly capable of looking at a white sheet of paper and insist that it's ironic black. Only the really dumb can't see the irony.

Strangely enough, they are mostly the same people who thought that Obama fully deserved the Nobel Peace Prize.

Kaa

pefjr
10-23-2009, 03:04 PM
Well, not really dumb... just a bit dumber than the audience, who laughed.

And probably not actually dumb... just idealogically constrained and clinging desperately to a bankrupt reason to disaprage someone.

For some people, it's just sooooo easy to take a shot.Maybe you are intelligent enough to answer that question then. Yes or no?:)

Kaa
10-23-2009, 03:05 PM
Well, not really dumb... just a bit dumber than the audience, who laughed.

And, of course, some people insist that the illusory whiteness of the sheet is nothing but a metaphor for black and so the sheet should properly be considered black... :-P

Kaa

Keith Wilson
10-23-2009, 03:05 PM
Some people seem to be perfectly capable of looking at a white sheet of paper and insist that it's ironic black. Perhaps there are such people. But if someone says their favorite political philosophers are Mao and Mother Teresa, the obvious and huge contradiction in that statement would lead anyone not completely blinded by ideology to assume that it wasn't intended to be taken literally.

Rick-Mi
10-23-2009, 03:07 PM
We've been over this multiple times.

Some people seem to be perfectly capable of looking at a white sheet of paper and insist that it's ironic black. Only the really dumb can't see the irony.

Strangely enough, they are mostly the same people who thought that Obama fully deserved the Nobel Peace Prize.

Kaa


You've got it all wrong Kaa, the problem is some people don't recognize a metaphor when they see one!!!





;)





:D



.

ljb5
10-23-2009, 03:08 PM
Strangely enough, they are mostly the same people who thought that Obama fully deserved the Nobel Peace Prize.

And on the other side, we have the people who think Palin deserves the Nobel Peace Prize. :rolleyes:

Kaa
10-23-2009, 03:10 PM
Perhaps there are such people. But if someone says their favorite political philosophers are Mao and Mother Teresa, the obvious and huge contradiction in that statement would lead anyone not completely blinded by ideology to assume that it wasn't intended to be taken literally.

GOTO post #169

We're looping, Keith :-)

Kaa

High C
10-23-2009, 03:12 PM
GOTO post #169

We're looping, Keith :-)

Kaa

http://www.softwaremag.com/archive/2001feb/images/ChasingItsTail.jpeg

pefjr
10-23-2009, 03:14 PM
And on the other side, we have the people who think Palin deserves the Nobel Peace Prize. :rolleyes:That's why I drafted you and pitched you in the "Being Obtuse" World Series. Good job.:D

Kaa
10-23-2009, 03:18 PM
http://www.missrhondasreaders.com/pictures/hamster.gif

:D

Kaa

ljb5
10-23-2009, 04:26 PM
GOTO post #169

We're looping, Keith :-)

Kaa

No, you are looping.

In post #178, you acknowledged that we're just going to have to disagree on this point.

And here you are, sixty posts later and you're still arguing the same point.

Milo Christensen
10-23-2009, 04:48 PM
And on the other side, we have the people who think Palin deserves the Nobel Peace Prize. :rolleyes:

And a few who think she'd be a Novel Piece.

I, Rowboat
10-23-2009, 08:02 PM
Nope, not so novel. Go to Colorado Springs or any other suburbopolis and you'll find plenty of primped-up, empty-headed, mega-christian, ex-beauty pageant, speaking-in-tongue god soldiers. Those places are just littered with 'em.

ishmael
10-23-2009, 08:58 PM
Just to be clear, from what I understand Ms. Dunn didn't quote Mao, she said he was one of her top two political philosophers. Huge difference.

Kaa
10-23-2009, 09:04 PM
In post #178, you acknowledged that we're just going to have to disagree on this point.

"We"? You're now Keith? :eek: Interesting...


And here you are, sixty posts later and you're still arguing the same point.

'cause Keith went for another round :-) What's it to you? You are already on the record that white is black, has always been black, especially during the Bush times :D and will always be black. Anyone who doesn't see white as black is mentally deficient and is barely worthy to grovel before your munificence. So what else is new?

Kaa

Kaa
10-23-2009, 09:06 PM
Just to be clear, from what I understand Ms. Dunn didn't quote Mao, she said he was one of her top two political philosophers. Huge difference.

She did both. She said he's one of her favorite political philosophers, and then she went and told a little dear-Great-Leader story which included a quote by Mao. In that story Mao, of course, embodies her point and we -- and the schoolkids -- are supposed to behave like Mao did.

Kaa

Flying Orca
10-23-2009, 09:11 PM
She did both. She said he's one of her favorite political philosophers, and then she went and told a little dear-Great-Leader story which included a quote by Mao. In that story Mao, of course, embodies her point and we -- and the schoolkids -- are supposed to behave like Mao did.

Oh, Kaa... I understand what you're doing, but do you think you should be using quite that much chum? ;)

Kaa
10-23-2009, 09:19 PM
Oh, Kaa... I understand what you're doing, but do you think you should be using quite that much chum? ;)

Nuthin' but the truth :D Any of it makes you uncomfortable..?

Kaa

Flying Orca
10-23-2009, 09:23 PM
I haven't seen the quote under discussion and I don't much care about it. I do think it's rather ludicrous to condemn someone as a "radical leftist" for quoting Mao-Tse, but hey, it's far from the strangest thing about US politics.

bobbys
10-23-2009, 09:29 PM
Nope, not so novel. Go to Colorado Springs or any other suburbopolis and you'll find plenty of primped-up, empty-headed, mega-christian, ex-beauty pageant, speaking-in-tongue god soldiers. Those places are just littered with 'em..

That might be true i see the libs fly out of Colorado on there balloons.

pefjr
10-23-2009, 09:44 PM
To read too many books is harmful.
Mao Zedong (http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/m/maozedong146714.html)

War can only be abolished through war, and in order to get rid of the gun it is necessary to take up the gun.
Mao Zedong (http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/m/maozedong146720.html)


Two of the best quotes I could find by Mao.
Smart guy this Mao.

Mother Teresa's quotes are mostly about smiling and love.

I will have to email the Yogi Berra quotes to Anita, they are much better, don' ya think Orca.

Kaa
10-23-2009, 09:44 PM
I haven't seen the quote under discussion and I don't much care about it.

:eek: :eek:

"I haven't seen the quote, but I have my opinion of it and I'm sticking with it. Don't confuse me with facts!" :D I appreciate your candor, though.

If you change your mind, most of the quote is in this very thread, post #143. A bit more is in #164.


I do think it's rather ludicrous to condemn someone as a "radical leftist" for quoting Mao-Tse, but hey, it's far from the strangest thing about US politics.

You might note that I did not condemn Anita Dunn and did not call her a "radical leftist".

Kaa

ishmael
10-23-2009, 09:51 PM
"rather ludicrous to condemn someone as a "radical leftist" for quoting Mao-Tse Tung"

Quoting him is fine, depending on the quote and the context. Extolling him as a personal favorite is worrisome.

He should be roundly condemned, not admired. It's as though there's a willful amnesia on the Left around how evil this man was. Again, if I said I admired and hold dear Hitler's political philosophy, how do you think that would fly?

ljb5
10-23-2009, 11:13 PM
if I said I admired and hold dear Hitler's political philosophy, how do you think that would fly?


If we thought you meant it sincerely and without irony or sarcasm, it would not fly well.

If you were obviously being ironic, we wouldn't flip out.

I can understand if you think her quote was in poor taste..... but can you possibly think it was genuine evidence of Maoist allegiance?

Do you honestly think she loves and idolizes Mao?

Flying Orca
10-24-2009, 10:28 AM
"I haven't seen the quote, but I have my opinion of it and I'm sticking with it. Don't confuse me with facts!" :D I appreciate your candor, though.

If you change your mind, most of the quote is in this very thread, post #143. A bit more is in #164.

Sorry, I should have been more precise. ;) I have read everything in this thread, but I have not read original documentation of the quote incident, nor have I watched the video that I gather exists. What interests me is the reaction I'm seeing here.


You might note that I did not condemn Anita Dunn and did not call her a "radical leftist".

I'm well aware of that; I didn't think I'd said you had, nor would I have expected you to.


Extolling him as a personal favorite is worrisome.

He should be roundly condemned, not admired. It's as though there's a willful amnesia on the Left around how evil this man was.

Tell me, how "evil" was Mao, then? And while you're at it, can you define "evil" for me?

oznabrag
10-24-2009, 11:39 AM
Tell me, how "evil" was Mao, then? And while you're at it, can you define "evil" for me?

Yes. I'd very much like to know, myself!

I list Hernan Cortez as one of my personal heroes. Maybe Mao Zedong has a place in my personal Pantheon.

I know nothing, really, of Mao's history, but I've heard him demonized many, many times. Still he was responsible for wresting control of China from the old Dynasty/Warlord System, as I understand it.

The forumite best able to give us insight to this may be Andrew Craig-Bennett. Perhaps he'll drop through and give us the skinny.

Hot Air
10-24-2009, 11:54 AM
A good place to start would be "The Unknown Story:Mao" by Jung Chang and Jon Halliday.

The man was a Machivellian killing machine. You guys need to brush up on your history before you choose who will be in your "personal Pantheon." But who knows, maybe you'll actually be inspired.

ishmael
10-24-2009, 11:56 AM
Norman,

I'm trying to think of the logical fallacy you are engaging in. It's one of the seven cardinal, and dammit I should remember it.

Again, reading someone, quoting them, isn't the same as admiring them. I've read Hitler, Mao, Stalin, and while all of them could turn a phrase on occasion, their philosophies were dark. Admiring any one of them, saying they are in your top two, is a call for questions.

ishmael
10-24-2009, 12:08 PM
Aha, found it, the fallacy, after a short web search. Appeal to emotion.

It can work rather well, but a skilled opponent will call you on it, and a skilled debate judge will agree.

oznabrag
10-24-2009, 12:26 PM
...

The man was a Machivellian killing machine...

That's crazy! So was Montezuma! Of course, Cortes turned this to his political advantage immediately, quite a different tale from Mao, if I you understand correctly.

pefjr
10-24-2009, 01:32 PM
Ish, I think you are wasting your time. It's like the macho defending their manhood. They will fight to the death even in the face of hypocrisy such as Norman's ridiculous reference to Bush. Orca wants a definition of evil??? And Now, Oznabrag wants to bring in his personal hero. Neither one even knows about Mao, or pretend not to. I have a copy of this thread to illustrate the hardheadedness of Liberals caught with their pants down.

I have confidence the high schools students will not fall for this "irony".

ljb5
10-24-2009, 01:36 PM
It's a good thing no one here supports the Catholic Church.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7c/Torture_Inquisition.jpg

Anyone ever heard of the Spanish Inquisition?

Torture, persecution, imprisonment and execution...

But that's okay, of course, because it was all in service to the Pope... and it's okay to like the Pope. :)

pefjr
10-24-2009, 02:29 PM
Yeah, the pope is relevant here. :rolleyes:Like Bush is relevant, like playing dumb, like bringing in Cortes, etc.. :rolleyes:Time to move on guys. If you can not see past your liberal nose, if you can't answer a simple question, if you know nothing of evil, or of Mao, then its time to move on to something you can participate in intellectually.

I can see Beck was dead wrong when calling Obama a racist. We agree. Fox should fire the guy for lack of responsible journalism. Its a reflection on Fox that they have not disciplined or fired Beck. But Beck, in his scrabble to stay alive has uncovered radical elements of the Obama Administration. First Van Jones, and now Dunn. The fact that you bilge liberals will not admit this is a reflection of your lack of honesty.:)

Keith Wilson
10-24-2009, 02:49 PM
if you know nothing of evil, or of Mao, then its time to move on to something you can participate in intellectually. Give it a rest. I would be willing to bet I know quite a bit more about Mao than you do, and at least as much about evil. :rolleyes:

Beck has uncovered nothing at all, although he's invented quite a lot. Once again, unless you can show any evidence at all other than this one quote that Ms. Dunn is any kind of radical, or that she actually thinks well of Mao, you're talking complete nonsense.

ljb5
10-24-2009, 03:00 PM
...if you can't answer a simple question...

I have not avoided answering any questions on this thread.

This is my position: sure, Mao was evil, (then again, so was the Catholic Church.)

But since Ms. Dunn is not really a Maoist, does not truly idolize him, is not in love with him and does not consider him her hero, it doesn't matter.

Glenn Beck's claims have been disproven. He used words ("hero", "idolize", "love", etc..) that are not supported by the evidence. He also clipped her quote to alter the meaning.

I agree with you 100% that Mao was a bastard, but this doesn't mean that Ms. Dunn was wrong to quote him as she did.

And it sure as hell doesn't mean she idolizes him or is a "dangerous radical"!!!!

Robmill0605
10-24-2009, 03:10 PM
And it sure as hell doesn't mean she idolizes him or is a "dangerous radical"!!!! __________________Gee, funny how Obama seems to surround himself with them The Rev. Wright, Bill Ayers, Van Jones and more.:cool:

ljb5
10-24-2009, 03:14 PM
Gee, funny how Obama seems to surround himself with them The Rev. Wright, Bill Ayers, Van Jones and more.:cool:

Obama surrounds himself with people who Glenn Beck falsely labels as dangerous radicals??

That really sounds more like Beck's problem than Obama's problem.

Still no one has offered any evidence that she's actually a Maoist or any form of "dangerous radical."

Robmill0605
10-24-2009, 03:20 PM
Obama surrounds himself with people who Glenn Beck falsely labels as dangerous radicals??

That really sounds more like Beck's problem than Obama's problem.

Actually it sounds more like it'sObamas problem since Beck is winning, and the WH is so off balance they are going after FOX and playing defense.

Nothing like a good old fashioned Nixon style enemies list eh?

ljb5
10-24-2009, 03:32 PM
Actually it sounds more like it'sObamas problem since Beck is winning, and the WH is so off balance they are going after FOX and playing defense.

They are "going after FOX" and "playing defense"??

Which is it? ;)

Actually, Obama is winning. He's in the White House.

New report out today says Republicans' approval ratings is at a shocking low, not seen since their failed attempt to impeach Clinton more than 10 years ago.

Go ahead and keep "winning" like that. It's exactly why the Republicans lost the Senate, the House and the Presidency.

oznabrag
10-24-2009, 03:36 PM
...And Now, Oznabrag wants to bring in his personal hero. Neither one even knows about Mao, or pretend not to. ...

You're a liar.

pefjr
10-24-2009, 03:38 PM
[quote=Keith Wilson;2362142]Give it a rest. I would be willing to bet I know quite a bit more about Mao than you do, and at least as much about evil. :rolleyes:

quote]:D And your are proof of the inability of a WB bilge liberal to admit anything is questionable here. You want to downgrade the discussion to "I know more than you about this or that". Hey, you are dealing with an "old white southern wacko", watch your step. :)And don't bother me anymore with your dishonesty. I am watching football. Yeah I know, you know more about football than bla.. bla.. .bla.

And if you know so much about evil, I'll let you explain it to Orca, he doesn't know hockey. :D

pefjr
10-24-2009, 03:39 PM
[quote=ljb5;2362154]I have not avoided answering any questions on this thread.

This is my position: sure, Mao was evil, (then again, so was the Catholic Church.)

quote]The question is simple post #222


Lets take a peek.

Do you quote someone in the context that she was speaking, that you do not admire?

http://www.woodenboat.com/forum/images/misc/progress.gif
Its easy, yes or no.

pefjr
10-24-2009, 03:41 PM
You're a liar.And that's your MO. Name calling:D:D

ljb5
10-24-2009, 03:43 PM
Do you quote someone in the context that she was speaking, that you do not admire?

Its easy, yes or no.

Sure. Why not?

Lots of people quote Mao. Bush and Rove, Atwater and McCain to name just a few.

Heck, Nixon even shook his hand!

Barry Goldwater had a campaign advisor who claimed to use his tactics!

If you have a spare minute, please provide us with an "approved list" of everyone we're allowed to quote.

Also, please explain who the hell appointed you as the Thought Police!

pefjr
10-24-2009, 03:49 PM
Sure. Why not?

Lots of people quote Mao. Bush and Rove, Atwater and McCain to name just a few. :D Defend to the death!! March on. :D

oznabrag
10-24-2009, 03:49 PM
And that's your MO. Name calling:D:D


You are, once again, quite incorrect.

I am not 'calling you a name', I am accusing you of lying. Lying (to yourself and everyone else) is your MO. It's a trait you share with Beck, Limbaugh, Coulter, Reagan, both Bushes, Rove, Cheney, etc., etc.

The simple fact of the matter is that I know almost exactly nothing about Mao Zedong, because the fact is that I never went to collitch, boy.

You are a liar.

ljb5
10-24-2009, 03:51 PM
:D Defend to the death!! March on. :D

Now you're the one avoiding the question. :D

pefjr
10-24-2009, 03:51 PM
You are, once again, quite incorrect.

I am not 'calling you a name', I am accusing you of lying. Lying (to yourself and everyone else) is your MO. It's a trait you share with Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter et al.

The simple fact of the matter is that I know almost exactly nothing about Mao Zedong, because the fact is that I never went to collitch, boy.

You are a liar.Smoke , spin , dishonesty, hell throw anything at em, just slow them down!!!:D:D

oznabrag
10-24-2009, 03:53 PM
Smoke , spin , dishonesty, hell throw anything at em, just slow them down!!!:D:D

That certainly does seem to describe your tactics. Liar.

pefjr
10-24-2009, 04:00 PM
That certainly does seem to describe your tactics. Liar.Now ,you are reminding me and showing everyone your immaturity. Course, you guys wear that badge along with the banning badge. Not an embarrassment to you, so you have me at a disadvantage. That's OK, I'm game. :)