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View Full Version : Strip Building: Still edge nail if gluing?



Y Bar Ranch
09-14-2005, 12:36 PM
If you are strip building something big (not kayak or canoe) do you still want to edge nail if you are gluing the strips together? Does it help with clamping? Or just skip it?

paladin
09-14-2005, 12:53 PM
My 44 footer is glued....no nails etc....but I also have 2 layers of 1/8th inch veneer over and a couple of layers of Xynole epoxy...in N.Z. they just use maybe three layers of fabric epoxy over and one inside...no veneer....

outofthenorm
09-14-2005, 06:17 PM
My 28 ft cutter is glued, nailed and screwed to frames. 45 years and still going strong.

What does your designer say?

- Norm

[ 09-14-2005, 07:18 PM: Message edited by: outofthenorm ]

Tonyr
09-14-2005, 07:08 PM
I found it effective to screw rather than nail the strips. This let me really "clamp" them hard (good for the PU adhesive I was using) and ensured that the strips remained properly aligned. Screwing is a less demanding job than nailing, I found.

Tony.

Y Bar Ranch
09-15-2005, 07:51 AM
Originally posted by outofthenorm:
My 28 ft cutter is glued, nailed and screwed to frames. 45 years and still going strong.

What does your designer say?

- NormI'll let you know when the plans get here. ;)

I ordered the Canoe Yawl Eel plans. Currently clearing out the space in the garage.

Y Bar Ranch
09-15-2005, 07:52 AM
Originally posted by Tonyr:
I found it effective to screw rather than nail the strips. This let me really "clamp" them hard (good for the PU adhesive I was using) and ensured that the strips remained properly aligned. Screwing is a less demanding job than nailing, I found.

Tony.Tony, you edge-screwed the planks? Or just screwed them to frames?

Tonyr
09-15-2005, 02:21 PM
I edge-screwed the planks (.75" thick, 1.25" wide). No frames, so did not attach to them, but went the Sam Devlin route and designed and placed the hull interior following Dave Gerr's scantling rules, and bonded everything to the hull and to everything else. I ended up with some six bulkheads (or equivalent) in a 24' hull, and these are bonded (glued), not otherwise fastened. There are no fastenings to or through the hull itself.

Tony.

Norske3
09-15-2005, 06:03 PM
Hello everyone...this strip building...does it require a lot of beveling?..like every strip?..and a LOT of sanding to fair in the hull...a lot of epoxy seams to sand...not so easy..eh?

Tonyr
09-15-2005, 07:36 PM
Norske - no beveling or scarfing needed. Just use standard square edge strips of any convenient length, and butt as required. See "Strength of Boats" by Dave Gerr for detailed scantling rules here.

Re: adhesives, I use a PU rather than epoxy to glue strips (no mixing, mainly, and cheaper), but encapsulate with epoxy/FG when completed. Yes, you will have excessive sanding in exactly the proportion that you aren't very careful in lining up and clamping the strips in the first place, and also in that proportion that your strips are not uniform in thickness. It's a trade off. There's no free lunch.

Tony.

helvit
09-15-2005, 07:50 PM
Y Bar-- I've done one 20' boat with that construction,, and you know what they say about opinions....

Using 7d bronze ring nails through the edges of cedar strips 3/4" X 1 3/8" (one edge of each rolling beveled stem to stern) effectively clamped them where they were supposed to go. Can't think of a better way to get it done, with cedar. Fairing was a breeze. 2000' of those joints, all going strong to date.

That was Dave Stimson's Ocean Pointer.

Ross M
09-15-2005, 10:58 PM
Good post on the subject: Laminated panels puncture resistance (http://www.woodenboat-ubb.com/cgi-bin/UBB/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=009167&p=)

Ross

JimConlin
09-15-2005, 11:23 PM
One of the perennial arguments here is whether cove&bead edging on strip planking is worth the effort.
The arguments for are that you get tighter joints which look better if finished bright, use less adhesive, which might save a few pennies and make the panel a bit lighter and easier to fair, that you might get away with slightly greater spacing on the molds, and that the adjacent strips support and align one another, especially at strip joints, so fairing is easier.
The arguments against are that milling c&b strips is tedious, takes some specialized tools and jigs and uses slightly more planking material because of the diminished strip width.
All of these are true, to a degree.

Y Bar Ranch
09-16-2005, 08:52 AM
Originally posted by outofthenorm:

What does your designer say?

- NormPlans for the Eel call for nailing, gluing, and sheathing with dynel. He suggests using enough nails to hold it together for the gluing, and no more. Suggests resorcinal.

He also takes the steam bent frames for plank on frame, at 8" centers, and spreads them out to 16" centers for strip built.

outofthenorm
09-16-2005, 09:13 AM
Sounds like a sensible plan to me. In that construction, the nails are more of a building aid than a major component in the strength. It's not uncommon to use wider frame spacing for strip. It has relatively high panel strength, especially when sheathed.. Even though I hate the damn stuff, I'd probably go with epoxy rather that R, mostly because it's so forgiving of gaps.

The Eel is a pretty boat that's always been one of my favourites. Good luck with the project. Don't forget to post pics!

- Norm

[ 09-16-2005, 10:15 AM: Message edited by: outofthenorm ]