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Concordia..41
10-09-2002, 06:59 AM
Tuesday's agenda was to gain more access and involved removal of the triangular plank piece below the plank we took off Saturday and removing the plank directly above on both port and starboard. We're talking another 180+ screws and 19 bolts, but who's counting :rolleyes:

I'll link to a web page at the end of the post, but basically:

http://www.sailingwithsarah.com/Pic/Repair3lg.jpg

She's had problems for years probably related to the stern knee shrinking. It's obviously been loose for a long time. Several floor bolts are broken as well as the floors decaying over the years. Wedges were driven under the floors to tighten them up, but with the broken floor bolts this just added stress to the planks. We also removed enough cotton from the seams to stuff a mattress.

At a later date, someone added stainless allthread to pull the knee back in place to the stern post. With the floor bolts broken, this did not work so someone added a dutchman on each side to close the seam at the rabbit.

It boils down to when the problem was first found due to leakage a number of repairs were attempted but weren't sucessful because a total solution would have involved pulling the ballast, deadwood and engine.

This is Dave speaking here because you know all this is way over my head ... M

Dave knew the boat when it first came to St. Augustine over a decade ago, and he was aware of this leak and another up forward under the mast step, which is being corrected in the rebuild. That one also showed a very poor series of repairs involving massive amounts of caulking and then filling the area with underwater epoxy.

It's easy in hindsight to shake your head at the mess, but for the majority of her life, Sarah was well cared for. But even an attentive owner with unlimited resources probably wouldn't pull the engine, and drop the ballast and deadwood, because there's a leak in the lowest and most inaccessible portion of the bilge. At least not until all other options were exhausted.

Today's agenda involves removing the dutchmen on both sides so Dave and Nick can see what's going on there.

I knew we'd get comments on the supports or lack thereof, but she's fine. It's just one of those where the supports don't show in the picture. She's resting on solid blocking just forward of the photo area and there's another set of solid blocks directly under the stern. There's also two sets of tall jackstands up high in this area.

Thanks again for the kind comments. I may grouse a bit, but I can assure you there's no regrets.

Cheers!
- M

More pictures and analysis at http://www.sailingwithsarah.com/exposingsternknee2.htm

[ 10-11-2002, 03:05 AM: Message edited by: Concordia..41 ]

Dave Fleming
10-09-2002, 10:05 AM
Dave/Gert, what's the plan now? Pull out the stern knee and replace with a layered up one?
As you folks have found out ANY allthread, I don't care what material it is made of, is poor stuff for big strains. Were those wedges true wedges as in lifting heavy weights or corking wedges to seal the gap? I have always found it interesting how much boat timbers can dry out even in high hummmadidity areas. Methinks its time to make up some 'special sauce' to keep things under control. Though if you are going the goo-goo path perhaps not a good idea.
Oh, Chemist!

Concordia..41
10-10-2002, 01:45 AM
Dave, today we cut out the duchman, cut the floor bolts and removed the knee. Three of the floors were secured to the knee with bronze drifts. We also found broken bronze bolts. I cut the knee free and we removed it today.
Well will replace the knee with white oak and pull everything back to the original shape. Then we will build the floors to fit. We will not use drifts in the floors as they did before in that area. The engine bed is above the knee and I believe that over the years of gasoline, then diesel fuel and oil from the engine has caused some of our problems. Really doesn’t matter at this stage as it is just something else to fix and get on with the project. Today we added more supports before removing the knee along with making one new floor for up forward so we had a good day.
My wife, children and grand children will be sailing on Sarah in the years to come so she has to be in the best possible condition even if it takes longer to complete her.
I believe we have found the last major problem on Sarah and everything else will be putting her back together.
You are correct about all thread as it is a poor excuse for a real bolt. Thanks for your in put, from you it is always welcomed.

Dave

[ 10-10-2002, 02:48 AM: Message edited by: Concordia..41 ]

Concordia..41
10-10-2002, 06:52 AM
Pictures at 11 smile.gif

- M

Dave Fleming
10-10-2002, 10:48 AM
Gert/Dave a question?
Am I correct in recalling that the Concordia's were also built bye A&R in Germany?

Ed Harrow
10-10-2002, 11:24 AM
All but the first two or three, Dave.

Concordia..41
10-10-2002, 11:43 AM
Dave – Margo was wrong, A&R built 99 of the 103. Casey built the first one in 1938, Lawley built #2 in 1939. Casey built #3 in 1946 and #4 in 1947. A&R started with #5 in 1950 and completed the last one #103 in 1966. A&R built Sarah in 1955 along with 11 others that year. (#24 through #35 – this is the most they built in one year.)

Dave

Dave Fleming
10-10-2002, 11:43 AM
Ah, thank goodness some of the little grey cells are still working. smile.gif

Dave Fleming
10-10-2002, 12:34 PM
Oh m'gosh Sara's Dave are you brave!
"Margo was wrong", I dunno if I would have put it quite that way. Diplomacy don'cha know.

<insert large Rum belly laugh here>

;)

Concordia..41
10-10-2002, 04:50 PM
Yeah, that one sure got past the editorial board ;)

- M

Peter Malcolm Jardine
10-10-2002, 08:31 PM
I think there is something about wooden boats that lets us in on the fact that there will be more work than we might see at first... but you guys have a great boat, and seem to have to the grit and wherewithall to see it through... Hurrah for you!!

Norske3
10-15-2002, 05:55 AM
No turning back now....as long as you stay in lust..I mean in love ... smile.gif with the beautiful curves of your boat...you wont dispair...yes it's the curves ..the fine sweeping curves of this thing we call "boat"..thats why so few of us wooden heads ever fall for a wooden barge, no matter how well built it is......so true ..so true...its all about wooden curves. :D ..Ah..that's a mystery..to me it is...why is a line that's constantly changing direction at a constant rate or a changing rate so appealing to the eye?...so satisfying to the mind...I find myself staring at the shape of my boat frequently..still looking at her after twenty years without tiring of it!...it keeps awake sometimes thinking, thinking...I in love with my boat!...maybe thats why men call it a "She".. smile.gif .....OR ...a "sheila"! ..if your an Aussy! HA! :D ..it so happens me wifes name is Sheila..maybe thats why ...I'm ..no ...theres more to her than that...time to stop thinking... ;)

[ 10-15-2002, 07:27 AM: Message edited by: Norske3 ]