Is it cheaper to buy a new wood boat or restore an older one?

[croberts]

What is generally more cost-effective - buy new or purchase older and restore?

[TomRobb]

Yes :D

[Pelle]

My personal view is this: If there is a lot to do, like my project replacing frametops, deckbeams, carlins, decking and some hull-planking: Go for building a new boat. If you're working indoors under a controllable enviroment, chances are that every step you go takes you in the right direction. The only good reason for restoring a boat (at least a big project) in my view would be sentimental aspects. A sudden crush of love for a boat you've never seen before could prove fateful. I've seen many people very enthusiastic go on with a big project, but very few completing one. If my boat was not my love since 26 years back, I would never have started restoring it, I would have built myself a Maleo or Daniel Wells tugboat, or possibly a diesel duck or likewise. One reason to go for a modest restoring object could be if the onboard systems were good (fueltanks, engine, electrical and so on). This is costly to buy new.
To sum up: My project has been blood, sweat and money the last 2 years. I would NEVER go this road again with ANY other boat. Although I haven't cried yet, some of you out there (Ed and others) will know how it can be.
Project described at http://home.world-online.no/~dreggen

Per Olav

[Thad]

Great boat and a fine story, Per Olav!

[paladin]

well now...what kind of boat did you have in mind????

[Bob Cleek]

No bout a doubt it... it is cheaper and easier to build a new wooden boat than to restore an old one. HOWEVER... you'd better have restored a whole bunch of old ones to learn how it is done before you try building a new one from scratch or you are bound to screw it up. If you want to become a clock maker... start by taking apart old clocks. Boatbuilding is an exercise in not making the same mistakes twice.

[Ed Harrow]

Ummmmm, how should I answer this... How much money do you have? How much time do you have? Realistically I could never buy a boat like Phoenix new... While I don't have 26 years of sentiment for her, I did grow up with a Lawley boat, and spent much of my "formative" years poking around the old Lawley yard.

It is an education, and there is a lot of going backward. I've been going backward for nearly a year now, but I look at it as a voyage of dicovery. If you go the resto route, be very, very selective about your choice and price.

Very, very nice, Per!

[ 05-04-2002, 07:51 PM: Message edited by: Ed Harrow ]

[JMAC]

I procured a free 23' centerboard sloop, an A.R. True Rocket. I just scraped, sanded and revarnished the boom last week. I was holding the nicely made bronze gooseneck fitting a few hours ago thinking- if I had to buy a new one of these it would cost me a bundle...I say look for a nice old wooden boat that is in good shape so that there is no restoration, only maintenance.

[ford]

how long is a piece of string?
I started 18 months ago to reconstruct my boat, to date I have replaced/scarfed 38 ribs with about another 30 to go, repaired 8 floors and built 1 floor from scratch and I still feel I've just begun. Tis a massive task depending on the problems you encounter, the best luck I had was to be in a yard that is simpatico with my task and to be surrounded with knowlegeable people so I am never alone.

[Wild Dingo]

The mighty Neptune alone knows!!... me?... Im still muddling it all out!

A job like Eds bothers the beejeesus out of me... and the one in front of Chris with Etain would make me quiver... mainly from excitement :D ... but somehow Im begining to think Bob and Mike are somehow about right...

Guess like anything it will come down to choice and accepting the outcomes of that choice :eek:

Take it easy
Shane

[Allen Foote]

There is nothing more expensive than a "FREE" boat. :D

[rickprose]

just as it is always cheaper to repair an old car than buy a new one, it is always cheaper to restore an old boat than to buy (or build) a new one. anyone who can show me the receipts to prove otherwise can send them to me via my email address.
as a wooden boat builder and renter of wooden boats through my boat livery, i have become a magnet for anyone in the vicinity who has a boat to give away, some of which i pass along to customers, some of which i restore for my own use, and i can tell you that in nearly fifteen years of doing this professionally, i have never seen a restoration cost as much as a new-built boat.
even if the old boat you choose to restore is a friggin' wreck that reeks of rot spores and spilled rum, to completely re-build it, piece by piece, you are saving the costs of plans, lofting, building molds, casting ballast and hardware, at the very least.
does that answer the question?

[Ed Harrow]

ROTFLMHO Allen! As another said, "People oft pay too dear for what's given freely."

[jeff pierce]

Interesting...

Several respondents here have compared restoring vs. building new, but that wasn't the question. The original post said 'buy' and made no mention of 'build'. Seems to me there may be a significant difference in the cost between 'buy' and 'build'. For me, one of the financial benefits to building is that you don't need to shell out all the cash at once. You can take it at your (and your wallet's) own pace.

'croberts', are you still here? Just curious, is building new not an option?

[Kermit]

Depends. And if you choose the wrong project for your skills, perserverance, and pocketbook, that's what you'll be wearing before you're done: Depends.

[gary porter]

Why not buy a good used boat that does not need restoring???? Espcially if the point is to get on the water. I often tell my wife that being on the water and building a boat are two very different things, one is not required of the other.
Its such a vague question that it really can't be answered but there are alot of very good boats available that don't need much if any restoration.

[Larry Exum]

I think, based on my limited knowledge, that CAREFUL searching for a boat to restore is cheaper. With Careful being the operative word. Make use of the best Surveyor and if in doubt, hire a second surveyor to recheck any questionable areas.

I lucked out (in many ways, see Gasoline pump post) with my find of a very dry Chris Craft Constellation 45'. Fourty years of floating in the New York Sound with little use except liveaboard. Cosmetically, she was a mess, with wood rot limited to the damned leaky window areas. Sometimes soon, I will post photos of the before and after, but for now I'm too busy remodelling.

In my case, I paid $20,000 for the boat, $3,000 for the transport, $7,000 to completely go through both engines (1992 Chrysler 440 CI with only 400 hours each). I have since put another $20,000 into the remodel. Could I buy a new (or even newish) wood boat for that. NO, not possible. Nor could I ever have the immense pride that comes with doing it yourself.

We are the talk of the marina, and every weekend, we have a flow of dock walkers visiting to check on the progress. Makes ones head swell.

Since all the wood structure was strong and intact, our work has only involved refinishing all wood surfaces inside and out. We have replaced the railings, new SSteel stanchions, New Tempered Glass on all windows, and new rub rails. Inside, we gutted the galley, and updated to modern convenience. Rip out all copper tubing, electric wire, rectifier, sanitation systems, and start over on the systems with new. Put in an inverter, have a recent (1997 Onan) Generator, and then you will know that all will work properly when you need it.

[ 05-06-2002, 06:34 PM: Message edited by: Larry Exum ]

[Vern D]

PER OLAV, THAT IS ONE FINE BOAT YOU HAVE THERE!!!!

:D
VERN AND JAKE (THE WONDER DOG)

[Alan D. Hyde]

If you haven't visited Per Olaf's site, please use the link above and do so.

He has a beautiful vessel, but it's taking some dirty, draining, wearying, gut-wrenching work to bring her back.

It makes what I have to deal with on my boat (which sometimes disgusts me) look like a picnic!

Alan

Just for convenience, here's the link

http://home.world-online.no/~dreggen

[ 05-09-2002, 12:09 PM: Message edited by: Alan D. Hyde ]

[oceangoddess]

Having done both I would definitely say restoring an oldie is MUCH cheaper than building a new one.

As someone mentioned, just buying the bits is phenomenally expensive. I was actually lucky when I found Fiona II since Frank, builder of the hull, had had all the stainless decking bits made, and I bought a rig which comes complete with rotten mast but all the stainless goodies, which by themselves would have cost twice as much as I paid for the whole rig.

However, "restoration" is also spelt "tenacity" and "patience" and "understanding SO", because no one except you will be able to envision what this pile of junk is going to turn into. Yes?

[Ruaridh]

Absolutely.
And - as has kind of been pointed out - its different doing it mostly yourself than paying to have it done.
Doing the stuff yourself is about so much more than financial cost.
My suspicion is, that if you're paying professionals, contractors, etc. a new build would come out better value, despite some of the opinions above.
R.

[Zumsel]

If you want to see a beautiful restoration project, go to that side. 10.000 hours of work!!!
http://www.skarp.no/

Jochen